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#1 2020-05-15 23:19:41

fsmithred
Administrator
Registered: 2016-11-25
Posts: 1,619  

Can live isos be burned to optical media?

All you devuan derivateurs, please tell me - if you burn your beowulf isos to optical media and boot a computer that has usb mouse and keyboard, do those inputs work on the desktop? If so, I'd like to know how you got that to happen.

Thanks,
fsmithred

See roughly the last page or two of this discussion for more details:
https://dev1galaxy.org/viewtopic.php?pid=21671#p21671

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#2 2020-05-17 01:19:05

Ozi
Member
From: Less is More! Devuan powered!
Registered: 2017-03-15
Posts: 100  
Website

Re: Can live isos be burned to optical media?

Hi fsr

Is this also a problem when booting from a usb, or solely optical media?

Ozi

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#3 2020-05-17 02:45:31

wdq
Member
Registered: 2018-03-15
Posts: 55  

Re: Can live isos be burned to optical media?

Hello to the Devuan derivateurs corner, does that happen after install or update / upgrade ?
Does it work into a live session ?

Usually i encountered that problem when some packages of xserver are not getting installed so i recommend reinstalling xorg.
Before x starts  you might be able to use your keyboard so login and reinstall xorg .
Hope it helps you too.

Last edited by wdq (2020-05-17 02:47:29)

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#4 2020-05-17 10:58:16

fsmithred
Administrator
Registered: 2016-11-25
Posts: 1,619  

Re: Can live isos be burned to optical media?

Live iso burned to optical disk. (I've only tried DVD, because the isos are too big for CD.)
Auto-login is enabled in the official beowulf desktop-live isos.
It boots.
It goes to desktop.
You can't use keyboard or mouse.

I didn't notice this problem becuase I don't use optical disks anymore.

There's a much better description of the problem in the linked discussion. I was nice enough to link you to the last two of the 23 pages. Please take a look at that discussion for clues. I'd like to fix this problem, not just rename the isos to .img and tell everyone they are usb images. I'm hoping someone who knows something that I don't know will look at that and see where the actual problem is.

Thanks,
fsmithred (not a happy camper.)

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#5 2020-05-18 12:00:52

fsmithred
Administrator
Registered: 2016-11-25
Posts: 1,619  

Re: Can live isos be burned to optical media?

I believe the problem has been fixed by installing acpi-fakekey. Can anyone confirm or refute?

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#6 2020-05-18 16:25:07

James1138
Member
Registered: 2018-09-27
Posts: 32  

Re: Can live isos be burned to optical media?

Burn Optical Media

https://wiki.debian.org/BurnCd

wodim -v dev=/dev/sr0 -dao my.iso
cdrskin -v dev=/dev/sr0 -dao my.iso
xorriso -as cdrecord -v dev=/dev/sr0 -dao my.iso

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#7 2020-05-18 16:38:48

golinux
Administrator
Registered: 2016-11-25
Posts: 2,022  

Re: Can live isos be burned to optical media?

@James1138 . . . You might want to read a thread before posting . . .

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#8 2020-05-18 20:31:45

fsmithred
Administrator
Registered: 2016-11-25
Posts: 1,619  

Re: Can live isos be burned to optical media?

And it's still screwed up. No audio when boot from dvd, except when booted to ram. Fixed by modprobe the sound module. In my case, 'modprobe snd_hda_intel'

Here's a list of modules that get loaded when booting to ram but not when booting normally. If anyone has any ideas about wtf is going on, I'd love to hear it.

cmac
btusb
btrtl
btbcm
btintel
intel_rapl
arc4
x86_pkg_temp_thermal
intel_powerclamp
rtl8723ae
coretemp
btcoexist
kvm_intel
rtl8723_common
rtl_pci
snd_hda_codec_hdmi
rtlwifi
snd_hda_codec_realtek
kvm
mac80211
uvcvideo
snd_hda_codec_generic
irqbypass
videobuf2_vmalloc
videobuf2_memops
videobuf2_v4l2
crct10dif_pclmul
crc32_pclmul
videobuf2_common
cfg80211
videodev
rtsx_usb_ms
snd_hda_intel
ghash_clmulni_intel
media
memstick
snd_hda_codec
snd_hda_core
intel_cstate
snd_hwdep
snd_pcm
intel_uncore
snd_timer
snd
intel_rapl_perf
pcspkr
joydev
efi_pstore
toshiba_bluetooth
pcc_cpufreq
iTCO_wdt
mei_me
serio_raw
efivars
soundcore
iTCO_vendor_support
mei
battery

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#9 2020-05-20 10:06:03

fsmithred
Administrator
Registered: 2016-11-25
Posts: 1,619  

Re: Can live isos be burned to optical media?

I'm seeing this problem on isohybrid-imaged usb. Anyone else experimenting with beowulf-based isos? C'mon guys, I need feedback. And help.

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#10 2020-05-20 11:19:48

Tobyb1906
Member
Registered: 2019-04-17
Posts: 20  

Re: Can live isos be burned to optical media?

Downloaded the 32bit iso yesterday, burned to usb using mintsticks on Mint19.3. I No issues with inputs or sound

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#11 2020-05-20 18:59:24

MiyoLinux
Member
Registered: 2016-12-05
Posts: 1,049  

Re: Can live isos be burned to optical media?

fsmithred wrote:

I'm seeing this problem on isohybrid-imaged usb. Anyone else experimenting with beowulf-based isos? C'mon guys, I need feedback. And help.

I'm sorry fsr, but I won't be much help.

On my builds, I install xorg (with recommends) and just take what that gives me. I don't add any special packages in addition to that, and USB mice and keyboards always work on my testing machines and the person's computer who helps me test the builds (when booting a live isohybrid image on a USB).

Last edited by MiyoLinux (2020-05-20 19:00:10)


I have been Devuanated, and my practice in the art of Devuanism shall continue until my Devuanization is complete. Until then, I will strive to continue in my understanding of Devuanchology, Devuanprocity, and Devuanivity.

Veni, vidi, vici vdevuaned. I came, I saw, I Devuaned. wink

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#12 2020-05-20 19:06:11

fsmithred
Administrator
Registered: 2016-11-25
Posts: 1,619  

Re: Can live isos be burned to optical media?

Thanks for testing i386. I hadn't gotten around to doing that.

Update:

I tried the amd64 iso on a different usb stick, and it works. (snd modules are loaded)

Then I tried the i386 iso on the usb stick that failed with the amd64. It works. (snd loaded)

Then I made a dvd of the i386 and the sound modules did not get loaded.

Oh yeah, booting the amd64 iso in qemu and checking how many modules get loaded with lsmod | wc -l gives me different numbers on different reboots. Sometimes sound is loaded, sometimes not.

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#13 2020-05-20 21:04:24

Tobyb1906
Member
Registered: 2019-04-17
Posts: 20  

Re: Can live isos be burned to optical media?

Hi, just downloaded 64bit version from leaseweb mirror. Burnt using Mintsticks on mint xfce 19.3,  audio out, usb ports, mouse and keyboard work fine when running live.
Can't test webcam or audio in

Last edited by Tobyb1906 (2020-05-20 21:58:38)

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#14 2020-05-20 21:43:31

Tobyb1906
Member
Registered: 2019-04-17
Posts: 20  

Re: Can live isos be burned to optical media?

This may be a red herring, apologies if I am talking garbage., I have read the beta thread  and if I am honest most of it goes well above my head.

However I have had a problem not dissimilar to this where I had issues with ISOs burned to usb.
But the issue was with so many different distro ISOs that I worked out it was my system that was common denominator causing a corruption in someway during the burn.
I think I was running Xenial based Mint at the time. I never got to the bottom of the problem properly.
I just reinstalled from an ISO on a USB stick that was burnt before the problem occured.
After that all the ISOs burnt and booted without fault.
Is there anything in common in the running systems of the people reporting errors with isos?

Last edited by Tobyb1906 (2020-05-20 21:54:00)

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#15 2020-05-21 08:46:37

rolfie
Member
Registered: 2017-11-25
Posts: 400  

Re: Can live isos be burned to optical media?

Some general thoughts to optical drives and media: my feeling is that todays drives are crap. You can buy BR drives that claim to support CD & DVD. My experience is that when i.e. I start a gparted life cd in such a BR drive as I have installed on the X570 MB  I'm getting lots of IO errors. Sometimes gparted works, sometimes it doesn't. Same with other media, i.e. Beowulf desktop iso. Booting same media in older drives works fine. 

On the modern HW I only use USB as boot media, never had issue like with these BR drives.

@fsmithred: does it make sense to try the desktop RC install iso on DVD (not the live version)? Does feedback on that help you?

rolfie

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#16 2020-05-21 09:20:35

Marjorie
Member
From: Teignmouth, UK
Registered: 2019-06-09
Posts: 77  

Re: Can live isos be burned to optical media?

I would be interested to know how many of us still use optical CD/DVD as installation media.

I've got one, but you can tell from the fact that is PATA that it's old. Solid drive, but my only use for it these days is to rip audio CDs.

Although I suspect we typically write ISOs to USBs (I also have the live iso loop mounted on hard disk) the nomenclature on the installers doesn't seem to have caught up with this (as a possibility let alone as a default) and the sources.list still points to a useless CD mount point, which has causes problems when you install, wireless and ethernet aren't working, but there are wireless drivers on your usb (this has happened to me, and to others on the forum).

FWIW. I've never had any media problems with the installation iso written to usb. I've used the live iso (just to check for compatibility) and then the full 'DVD' iso to do an expert install. Used both for ASCII (stable) and Beowulf (Beta 1).

The problems I have had relate to the expert partitioner (I got confused as to the sequence of steps required when installing on RAID1), with installing the NVIDIA drivers subsequent to initially installing OK with the default Nouveau drivers.

I also could never get it to work installing over ASCII (got into dependency hell) so did a new install and then merged a copy of my ASCII  /home directory back in.
As a comment on what's on the lave iso, for me it would be useful to have fsarchiver included, as with it the live iso is quite useful as a rescue disk (I hadlbacked up snapshots of the root and /home directories as .fsa archives and could reversibly swap them in and out. As it is I had to keep re-installing fsarchiver every time I booted the iso.

Last edited by Marjorie (2020-05-21 11:34:18)

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#17 2020-05-21 13:57:28

dev-1-dash-1
Member
Registered: 2018-08-02
Posts: 80  

Re: Can live isos be burned to optical media?

I myself don't often use optical images for installation in most cases.

My preferred method is to put isos on hard drive and create grub entries to boot into them. Writing the iso to a usb stick is as redundant as burning it to a dvd in most cases.

There are cases where it's not possible, or not convinient, to do it from hd and in those cases external media, dvd/usb, comes to the rescue.

My dvd drive is a very old ide drive. It's by no means "modern bd crap".
Jessie and ascii live/install images, burned to a dvd, always worked flawlessly for me. I also sometimes write an ubuntu lts version to a disc and it always worked without problem as well.

Also, fsmithred said that the problem appears on some usb configurations as well, it's not limited to optical media.

Last edited by dev-1-dash-1 (2020-05-25 14:17:31)

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#18 2020-05-21 18:08:15

fsmithred
Administrator
Registered: 2016-11-25
Posts: 1,619  

Re: Can live isos be burned to optical media?

The problems I've mentioned in this thread are specific to the live images. I think the only unsolved problem at this point is that the sound modules and some others don't get loaded every time you boot.

This may or may not be significant: The usb stick that had the failure was the no-name one I got for free. When I used one that I bought in a store, it worked. (A 16gb PNY)

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#19 2020-05-22 10:03:21

Tobyb1906
Member
Registered: 2019-04-17
Posts: 20  

Re: Can live isos be burned to optical media?

I have two usb sticks that I can't use and never could use for booting any distro ISOs . They either don't boot, produce errors in the boot process, or I get varied errors once booted. I can't find anything wrong with them even with low level scans and formats.
They're fine for music, video, word files, even to store ISOs....I can't explain it.

Similar point also I'd agree with Rolfie
Neither DVD burners or the Blank media are if the quality they were 10+ years ago.

Back then DVD burners and media were of better quality due to demand caused by a reasonably large amount of game piracy going in in the world. These required perfect clones no IO errors even the ability to copy the "bad sectors" on the original game disc, the burners and media quality needed to be a lot higher than for just burning a DVD movie, where any old cheap media and burner would do.

Whether any of that has the bearing on current issue with Beowulf ISOs is another matter.

Last edited by Tobyb1906 (2020-05-22 10:10:07)

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#20 2020-05-22 13:18:19

stanz
Member
From: Northern Earth ~ Brrrr
Registered: 2018-01-14
Posts: 162  

Re: Can live isos be burned to optical media?

No vm - my ol` dell laptop...

Burnt to dvd, ran - live & to ram:
working usb mouse - no sound.
lsmod live - 86
lsmod to ram - 129 (sound works)

Burnt to usb, ran - live & to ram:
working usb mouse - sound working.
lsmod - 131

Sorry fsr...I'm no help.
I'll check on desktop pc later today.

fsmithred wrote:

I believe the problem has been fixed by installing acpi-fakekey. Can anyone confirm or refute?

That fixed my beowulf build no-usb-mouse issue! yikes


miyoisomix.i2p

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#21 2020-05-25 13:55:23

pcalvert
Member
Registered: 2017-05-15
Posts: 75  

Re: Can live isos be burned to optical media?

I created a Devuan Beowulf ISO using Refractasnapshot. It boots OK in VirtualBox; I haven't tried booting from an actual DVD yet. However, there is no sound. I then checked the Devuan Beowulf system I used to create the ISO, and that has no sound either.

Phil


“Property is the fruit of labor; property is desirable; it is a positive good
in the world. That some should be rich shows that others may become
rich, and hence is just encouragement to industry and enterprise.”
— Abraham Lincoln

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#22 2020-05-25 14:04:55

dev-1-dash-1
Member
Registered: 2018-08-02
Posts: 80  

Re: Can live isos be burned to optical media?

I think I've found the fix.
Eudev needs group "kvm" to be present.

Try booting the beowulf live image rc from dvd into runlevel 1, after that

service eudev stop
groupadd kvm
service eudev start

Seems to fix the issue with missing modules. You don't even need acpi-fakekey for the mouse after that.

Update: turns out the kvm group has no effect - but stopping and restarting do.

Last edited by dev-1-dash-1 (2020-05-27 18:53:47)

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#23 2020-05-25 16:13:20

pcalvert
Member
Registered: 2017-05-15
Posts: 75  

Re: Can live isos be burned to optical media?

That may help with some issues, but it doesn't look like it will help with the no-sound issue (for me, anyway).

Here's why:

# groupadd kvm
groupadd: group 'kvm' already exists

Phil


“Property is the fruit of labor; property is desirable; it is a positive good
in the world. That some should be rich shows that others may become
rich, and hence is just encouragement to industry and enterprise.”
— Abraham Lincoln

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#24 2020-05-25 17:30:01

dev-1-dash-1
Member
Registered: 2018-08-02
Posts: 80  

Re: Can live isos be burned to optical media?

pcalvert wrote:

That may help with some issues, but it doesn't look like it will help with the no-sound issue (for me, anyway).

Here's why:

# groupadd kvm
groupadd: group 'kvm' already exists

Phil

Have you done that on the iso that you've created, or on the beowulf rc live-image?

I tested on the beowulf rc live-image burned to dvd.

I boot into runlevel 1. Run those commands.
Eudev instantly detects a lot of things that it didn't detect before that. Including pc-speaker. Also my console font immediately changes to the correct one. Means video-device is properly detected. Doing 'service alsa-utils restart' after that I get the sound immediately.
After that I purge the acpi-fakekey, start the desktop and everything including mouse and kbd works.

Beowulf live-image on dvd, no 'toram', bare-metal.

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#25 2020-05-25 18:56:34

pcalvert
Member
Registered: 2017-05-15
Posts: 75  

Re: Can live isos be burned to optical media?

dev-1-dash-1 wrote:

Have you done that on the iso that you've created, or on the beowulf rc live-image?

I did it using the ISO file I created. By the way, the Beowulf system I used to create the ISO started out as a Debian Buster standard system (no X). I wanted to see if building a Beowulf live CD/DVD in a slightly different way would yield better results.

Phil


“Property is the fruit of labor; property is desirable; it is a positive good
in the world. That some should be rich shows that others may become
rich, and hence is just encouragement to industry and enterprise.”
— Abraham Lincoln

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