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#1 2023-06-10 23:15:50

eyeV
Member
Registered: 2022-11-02
Posts: 13  

Devuan 5 Daedalus Release (Debian 12 - Bookworm) | Looking for info

Can you provide information about the release date of the new version of Devuan?
Debian 12 provides the latest versions of Gnome and KDE.
It looks like they will be in Devuan as well.

Personally, I'm really looking forward to these updates, and hope they will save me from numerous bugs
For example the bug with square corners on round themes in KDE 5.20.5
Or the dreaded Gnome Software 3.38.1 which takes a long time to load, and does not always install flatpak applications correctly, and then they do not start

In addition, there are now many small cosmetic bugs. And the endless attempts to make the plymouth theme work on an encrypted system
The system startup itself is visually awful, such as artifacts on the dark screen before the dock appears.

So we are waiting for the update.

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#2 2023-06-11 10:48:25

thierrybo
Member
Registered: 2017-11-11
Posts: 107  

Re: Devuan 5 Daedalus Release (Debian 12 - Bookworm) | Looking for info

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#3 2023-06-11 12:10:27

Camtaf
Member
Registered: 2019-11-19
Posts: 413  

Re: Devuan 5 Daedalus Release (Debian 12 - Bookworm) | Looking for info

Usually seems to be a few weeks after Debian, things have to be checked carefully before Devuan will put up the new release.

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#4 2023-06-11 15:17:49

boughtonp
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From: UK
Registered: 2023-01-19
Posts: 212  
Website

Re: Devuan 5 Daedalus Release (Debian 12 - Bookworm) | Looking for info

eyeV wrote:

Can you provide information about the release date of the new version of Devuan?

That information would be at the same place it always is, https://www.devuan.org/os/releases:

testing is where the next stable suite is developed. Software is usually more up-to-date but there may still be issues. testing becomes stable “when it is ready”.

-

Camtaf wrote:

Usually seems to be a few weeks after Debian, things have to be checked carefully before Devuan will put up the new release.

Where do you get "Usually" and "few weeks" from?

With Bullseye/Chimaera it took two months, which is the fastest it has been (presumably due to continued automation of previously manual tasks).

Assuming the effort required is equivalent between Bullseye and Bookworm, is there a reason to expect Daedalus before August?

Of course, it's also possible there's extra complexity that pushes things back further - I would assume the splitting of non-free and non-free-firmware, or the usr-merge stuff, both have potential to create extra work for the Devuan team which may mean things end up taking longer.


3.1415P265E589T932E846R64338

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#5 2023-06-11 17:04:23

eyeV
Member
Registered: 2022-11-02
Posts: 13  

Re: Devuan 5 Daedalus Release (Debian 12 - Bookworm) | Looking for info

Camtaf wrote:

With Bullseye/Chimaera it took two months, which is the fastest it has been (presumably due to continued automation of previously manual tasks).

Assuming the effort required is equivalent between Bullseye and Bookworm, is there a reason to expect Daedalus before August?

It's just awful if that's the case. It makes me think about changing the main OS to Debian after that. So everyone who uses Devuan gets new updates at least two months later than the "slowest" distribution.

But I guess I will have to stay with Devuan and wait for updates

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#6 2023-06-11 17:12:58

golinux
Administrator
Registered: 2016-11-25
Posts: 3,185  

Re: Devuan 5 Daedalus Release (Debian 12 - Bookworm) | Looking for info

It is always easier to complain than to roll up sleeves to help make it happen sooner, isn't it . . . roll

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#7 2023-06-11 17:21:33

Camtaf
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Registered: 2019-11-19
Posts: 413  

Re: Devuan 5 Daedalus Release (Debian 12 - Bookworm) | Looking for info

@ eyeV

N.B. It wasn't me who you quoted, but boughtonp..... big_smile

Last edited by Camtaf (2023-06-11 17:22:36)

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#8 2023-06-11 17:27:25

Camtaf
Member
Registered: 2019-11-19
Posts: 413  

Re: Devuan 5 Daedalus Release (Debian 12 - Bookworm) | Looking for info

boughtonp wrote:
Camtaf wrote:

Usually seems to be a few weeks after Debian, things have to be checked carefully before Devuan will put up the new release.

Where do you get "Usually" and "few weeks" from?

With Bullseye/Chimaera it took two months.....

Well there you go then........it took a few weeks...... wink

Usually = from past experience....

But basically, I was merely giving a rough time frame.......as in, not for a little while. smile

Last edited by Camtaf (2023-06-11 17:30:38)

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#9 2023-06-12 07:55:18

swanson
Member
Registered: 2020-04-22
Posts: 97  

Re: Devuan 5 Daedalus Release (Debian 12 - Bookworm) | Looking for info

It's worth the wait. Without question. As I see it, there are some fundamental differences between Debian and Devuan that needs extra care and attention. So I'm happy to wait.

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#10 2023-06-12 10:07:16

fsmithred
Administrator
Registered: 2016-11-25
Posts: 2,446  

Re: Devuan 5 Daedalus Release (Debian 12 - Bookworm) | Looking for info

So everyone who uses Devuan gets new updates at least two months later than the "slowest" distribution.

No, that's not the case at all. Devuan users have to wait a few hours after debian posts updates. The actual time it takes for the mirrors to update varies, but I think the longest is four hours.

The part that might not be ready is the installer isos and live isos. Those have to be put together and all the pieces might not be done today. I think we finished writing the release docs, but I'm not certain. Daedalus itself is ready. You can take your chances installing it from one of the new isos that might still have some bugs, or you can do a minimal install of chimaera and upgrade to daedalus, or if you already have chimaera, you can upgrade to daedalus.

If you use one of the new isos and find some bugs, you could let us know so we can fix it.

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#11 2023-06-12 18:31:23

rolfie
Member
Registered: 2017-11-25
Posts: 1,105  

Re: Devuan 5 Daedalus Release (Debian 12 - Bookworm) | Looking for info

Got my workstation and a laptop running Daedalus for several months now productive at home. No major issues, just smaller topics.

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#12 2023-06-13 19:32:26

jue-gen
Member
Registered: 2022-07-07
Posts: 109  

Re: Devuan 5 Daedalus Release (Debian 12 - Bookworm) | Looking for info

rolfie wrote:

... running Daedalus for several months ...

Yes, that's the same here with me.
But when Daedalus is actually ready, the sources.list should be adjusted (at will: security, updates, backports ... ).

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#13 2023-06-15 00:24:23

GNUser
Member
Registered: 2017-03-16
Posts: 561  

Re: Devuan 5 Daedalus Release (Debian 12 - Bookworm) | Looking for info

Yesterday I upgraded from Chimaera to Daedalus without any issues. Here are the steps I followed:

Edit /etc/apt/sources.list to point to daedalus
$ sudo apt-get update
$ sudo apt-get upgrade
$ sudo apt-get dist-upgrade # at the end there are some errors having to do with old version of linux kernel
$ sudo apt-get autoremove --purge # this removes the packages that caused errors
$ sudo apt-get dist-upgrade # now it completes without any errors
$ sudo apt-get autoclean
Reboot

I only use the main component of the repository. In other words, my /etc/apt/sources.list now looks like this:

deb http://deb.devuan.org/merged daedalus main

Since I don't have packages from contrib or non-free, I cannot comment on the current upgrade experience if your Chimaera system includes packages from those components.

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#14 2023-06-15 03:02:21

GlennW
Member
From: Brisbane, Australia
Registered: 2019-07-18
Posts: 601  

Re: Devuan 5 Daedalus Release (Debian 12 - Bookworm) | Looking for info

rolfie wrote:

Got my workstation and a laptop running Daedalus for several months now productive at home. No major issues, just smaller topics.

I'm the same, both Laptop and Desktop running Daedalus. :-) thankyou


pic from 1993, new guitar day.

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#15 2023-06-15 05:35:13

jue-gen
Member
Registered: 2022-07-07
Posts: 109  

Re: Devuan 5 Daedalus Release (Debian 12 - Bookworm) | Looking for info

GNUser wrote:

Yesterday I upgraded from Chimaera to Daedalus without any issues. Here are the steps I followed:

Edit /etc/apt/sources.list to point to daedalus
$ sudo apt-get update
$ sudo apt-get upgrade
$ sudo apt-get dist-upgrade # at the end there are some errors having to do with old version of linux kernel
$ sudo apt-get autoremove --purge # this removes the packages that caused errors
$ sudo apt-get dist-upgrade # now it completes without any errors
$ sudo apt-get autoclean
Reboot

Sometime about a year ago I read about Nala. I installed it and tried it out and stuck with it:

nala update && nala upgrade && nala clean && nala autopurge && nala autoremove

Now from Daedalus it can be used.

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#16 2023-06-15 15:49:37

Geoff 42
Member
Registered: 2016-12-15
Posts: 462  

Re: Devuan 5 Daedalus Release (Debian 12 - Bookworm) | Looking for info

boughtonp wrote:

That information would be at the same place it always is, https://www.devuan.org/os/releases:

I notice that on the Releases page that Daedalus is described under suites as In development, while the following text refers to testing.
Would it be more consistent if the entry under suites was testing?

Geoff

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#17 2023-06-15 17:18:20

Micronaut
Member
Registered: 2019-07-04
Posts: 208  

Re: Devuan 5 Daedalus Release (Debian 12 - Bookworm) | Looking for info

When I saw the announcement of Debian 12 I wondered how quickly the next Devuan release would follow. Good to see others had the same question. smile

Not in a rush, though. They should do everything right. This time I hope they get the proprietary video drivers to install without leaving issues that cannot be fixed.

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#18 2023-06-15 21:14:32

sgage
Member
Registered: 2016-12-01
Posts: 339  

Re: Devuan 5 Daedalus Release (Debian 12 - Bookworm) | Looking for info

Geoff 42 wrote:
boughtonp wrote:

That information would be at the same place it always is, https://www.devuan.org/os/releases:

I notice that on the Releases page that Daedalus is described under suites as In development, while the following text refers to testing.
Would it be more consistent if the entry under suites was testing?

Geoff

That would be more consistent, but the whole plot is thickened at the time of Debian releases. Daedalus really isn't 'testing' anymore. Nor is it the stable release, either...

Daedalus has been tracking Bookworm, which is now stable. So the general software set of Daedalus is Bookworm, i.e. Debian stable. Now, in order for Daedalus to be released as 'stable', we're basically waiting for the installers being tuned for every eventuality. It does seem to take a long time. In any case, the Daedalus installation I've been using since January is working perfectly.

So amprolla seems to interpret 'testing' in the sources of an up to date Daedalus installation as overlaying onto Debian 'stable' at this in between time. If you take a Daedalus installation and change the sources from 'daedalus' to 'testing', nothing much happens. If you take a Bookworm installation and change the sources from 'bookworm' to 'testing', you get about 80 new packages as testing is already starting to track the release-to-be-named-trixie.

At some point, 'testing' in the sources of a Daedalus installation will do the same after it is officially released as 'stable', and at that point you'd be tracking trixie/excalibur. But use the code name instead of 'testing', 'stable', etc., or you'll end up moving on from Daedalus. Unless of course that's what you want :-)

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#19 2023-06-16 10:58:14

stopAI
Member
Registered: 2023-04-04
Posts: 138  

Re: Devuan 5 Daedalus Release (Debian 12 - Bookworm) | Looking for info

I think a new version of Devuan (Daedalus) will be released when Debian 12 point release  is released.

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#20 2023-06-16 19:00:08

JonTheTwinsFan
Member
Registered: 2023-06-16
Posts: 1  

Re: Devuan 5 Daedalus Release (Debian 12 - Bookworm) | Looking for info

Question regarding Daedalus. If were to do a clean install using the Daedalus iso while it is in development, will there be any additional steps I'd need to make once Daedalus is moved to stable? Or would I be able to continue running Daedalus as installed?

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#21 2023-06-16 19:52:38

nixer
Member
From: North Carolina, USA
Registered: 2016-11-30
Posts: 202  

Re: Devuan 5 Daedalus Release (Debian 12 - Bookworm) | Looking for info

If were to do a clean install using the Daedalus iso while it is in development, will there be any additional steps I'd need to make once Daedalus is moved to stable? Or would I be able to continue running Daedalus as installed?

Unless there is a major change made that can not be altered by apt re-installing a package, then yes you should be able to continue using it.  Personally, I do not foresee this happening.  I am sure that this will be mentioned again, but you will need to alter your /etc/apt/sources.list file after daedalus goes stable.  Right now, only the "main" repo is available in daedalus.

Last edited by nixer (2023-06-16 19:53:23)

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#22 2023-06-16 19:55:43

rolfie
Member
Registered: 2017-11-25
Posts: 1,105  

Re: Devuan 5 Daedalus Release (Debian 12 - Bookworm) | Looking for info

As long as you keep the name Daedalus in the sources.list, there is no effect when the status of the suite changes from testing to stable or oldstable or ...
The only thing you will need to do is to enable security, updates and backports if required. They will become activated once Daedalus changes to stable.

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#23 2023-06-28 01:18:51

tylerdurden
Member
From: /home
Registered: 2018-07-16
Posts: 39  

Re: Devuan 5 Daedalus Release (Debian 12 - Bookworm) | Looking for info

boughtonp wrote:

Assuming the effort required is equivalent between Bullseye and Bookworm, is there a reason to expect Daedalus before August?

Of course, it's also possible there's extra complexity that pushes things back further - I would assume the splitting of non-free and non-free-firmware, or the usr-merge stuff, both have potential to create extra work for the Devuan team which may mean things end up taking longer.

Exactly my thoughts. I wish I could help out in that department but I'm afraid I lack the expertise to be much of much help there...

That said, I'm in no hurry to upgrade to the next release. Chimaera has been working great for me. In the meantime I've started testing the Daedalus preview on a spare machine to see what I can expect and compare.

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#24 2023-06-28 13:56:22

nixer
Member
From: North Carolina, USA
Registered: 2016-11-30
Posts: 202  

Re: Devuan 5 Daedalus Release (Debian 12 - Bookworm) | Looking for info

The only thing you will need to do is to enable security, updates and backports if required. They will become activated once Daedalus changes to stable.

I saw it mentioned somewhere, I think on the mailing list, that the "updates" and "security" parts are now active.  I have added this to the daedalus repository and can confirm that they are now active.  Have not checked the backports, yet.

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#25 2023-07-04 15:53:13

jue-gen
Member
Registered: 2022-07-07
Posts: 109  

Re: Devuan 5 Daedalus Release (Debian 12 - Bookworm) | Looking for info

nixer wrote:

... I have added this to the daedalus repository and can confirm that they are now active.  Have not checked the backports, yet.

I have this sources.list. I have not observed any problems so far.

deb http://deb.devuan.org/merged/ daedalus main contrib non-free non-free-firmware  
deb-src http://deb.devuan.org/merged/ daedalus main contrib non-free non-free-firmware  

deb http://deb.devuan.org/merged daedalus-security main contrib non-free non-free-firmware 
deb-src http://deb.devuan.org/merged daedalus-security main contrib non-free non-free-firmware 

deb http://deb.devuan.org/merged/ daedalus-updates main contrib non-free non-free-firmware 
deb-src http://deb.devuan.org/merged/ daedalus-updates main contrib non-free non-free-firmware 

deb http://deb.devuan.org/merged/ daedalus-backports main contrib non-free non-free-firmware 
deb-src http://deb.devuan.org/merged/ daedalus-backports main contrib non-free non-free-firmware 

deb http://deb.devuan.org/devuan daedalus-proposed-updates main contrib non-free non-free-firmware 
deb-src http://deb.devuan.org/devuan daedalus-proposed-updates main contrib non-free non-free-firmware

I would recommend this sources.list. Sources that are not wanted can be commented out

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