Advice needed from non-US users regarding keyboard layouts

MiyoLinux · 2017-08-02 00:45:01

Hi everyone! If I may ask a question, is it a serious problem for a user outside of the United States to use a US keyboard layout on a live system when trying out a distro? Can you try out a distro with a US keyboard layout without many problems?

I've tried several other keyboard layouts, and for the most part, they seem to follow the US keyboard layout (except for some special characters).

I'm looking at a keyboard switcher, but it only allows for three keyboard layouts.

Any input would be appreciated.

fsmithred · 2017-08-02 01:36:05

Test to see if you can add a layout on the fly in a live session. You can with the panel plugins for xfce and lxde.

MiyoLinux · 2017-08-02 03:16:30

fsmithred wrote:

Test to see if you can add a layout on the fly in a live session. You can with the panel plugins for xfce and lxde.

Thanks fsr. Yes, those panel plugins definitely work in live sessions. I'm still trying to stick with the tint2 panel though. I've found an application that definitely works...gxkb. However, gxkb appears to only allow for three layouts. I've contacted the developer to see if there's a way to add more, but I haven't heard back yet. It works just like the Xfce and LXDE panel plugins though...able to easily switch on the fly.

I've also found xxkb. It takes a lot more configuration though...and I haven't tried it yet to see how many layouts can be added.

I know it would be really convenient for live users to be able to use their native keyboard layout if possible, but at the same time, I would like to know if it's a "deal-breaker" if they can only use the US layout.

greenjeans · 2017-08-02 19:41:54

Tagging this thread as this is of interest to me too, I need to learn more about setting a system up for other keyboards, locales, and languages.

msi · 2017-08-02 21:55:12

MiyoLinux wrote:

I know it would be really convenient for live users to be able to use their native keyboard layout if possible, but at the same time, I would like to know if it's a "deal-breaker" if they can only use the US layout.

I'd definitely consider it a deal breaker for people used to German keyboard layouts. See https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:KB_Germany.svg

MiyoLinux · 2017-08-02 22:07:10

Okay, I heard back from the gxkb dev. He said that because of X11 protocol limitations, the most layouts possible are 4. I can only get three to work on gxkb though.

msi wrote:

MiyoLinux wrote:
I know it would be really convenient for live users to be able to use their native keyboard layout if possible, but at the same time, I would like to know if it's a "deal-breaker" if they can only use the US layout.
I'd definitely consider it a deal breaker for people used to German keyboard layouts. See https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:KB_Germany.svg

Thank you for the input msi! It's quite a coincidence that you responded. When I looked at the top three countries that have downloaded MiyoLinux, they are...

1. United Kingdom
2. United States
3. Anonymous Proxy (whatever that means)
4. Germany

My present intentions are to use those three (unless I can find something different) and give a quick guide on how to change the layout for other countries in the live session.

Thanks again msi, I really do appreciate the input.

FOSSuser · 2017-08-03 09:31:32

Having a US keyboard is a nuisance for us Brits, but not insurmountable, just have to poke around to see where keys have been put, most annoying are @ | ~ #

(If I need another layout, I use setxkbmap &/or loadkeys, usually works.)

MiyoLinux · 2017-08-03 18:44:15

FOSSuser wrote:

Having a US keyboard is a nuisance for us Brits, but not insurmountable, just have to poke around to see where keys have been put, most annoying are @ | ~ #
(If I need another layout, I use setxkbmap &/or loadkeys, usually works.)

Thanks FOSS! I appreciate your input friend!

I can certainly understand the dilemma.

shevy · 2017-08-16 02:21:05

> 3. Anonymous Proxy (whatever that means)

This may be some VPN and/or Tor downloads? Perhaps china or Iran or something like that.

> Having a US keyboard is a nuisance for us Brits, but not insurmountable, just have to poke
> around to see where keys have been put, most annoying are @ | ~ #

I myself use the german keyboard layout but write almost exclusive in english all day, give or
take; about 80% of my words typed in are english.

I'd wish that this distinction would not exist though... US keyboard or UK keyboard or the
different spelling. I was raised with UK english and grew up, sort of, with Monty Python so
the UK lifestyle is closer, but the US really overshadows most presence on the WWW. Just
take something simple like "color" in CSS, there is no alias called "colour" so I have to
use the US spelling. Or take youtube videos - many more from the USA than from the
UK.

In the long run, though, I'd really really really wish that the UK and US could unify and agree
on ONE system to rule them all. So to simplfiy everything!

It won't happen because of this though:

https://xkcd.com/927/

Last edited by shevy (2017-08-16 02:21:49)

MiyoLinux · 2017-08-16 02:49:21

shevy wrote:

> 3. Anonymous Proxy (whatever that means)
This may be some VPN and/or Tor downloads? Perhaps china or Iran or something like that.
> Having a US keyboard is a nuisance for us Brits, but not insurmountable, just have to poke
> around to see where keys have been put, most annoying are @ | ~ #
I myself use the german keyboard layout but write almost exclusive in english all day, give or
take; about 80% of my words typed in are english.
I'd wish that this distinction would not exist though... US keyboard or UK keyboard or the
different spelling. I was raised with UK english and grew up, sort of, with Monty Python so
the UK lifestyle is closer, but the US really overshadows most presence on the WWW. Just
take something simple like "color" in CSS, there is no alias called "colour" so I have to
use the US spelling. Or take youtube videos - many more from the USA than from the
UK.
In the long run, though, I'd really really really wish that the UK and US could unify and agree
on ONE system to rule them all. So to simplfiy everything!
It won't happen because of this though:
https://xkcd.com/927/

Thanks for the input shevy! The latest Miyo releases have US, GB, and DE (Germany) pre-set to aid non-US users. Instructions are included for anyone who may want to use a different layout other than those three.

Andrwe · 2022-06-20 18:46:10

MiyoLinux wrote:

Hi everyone! If I may ask a question, is it a serious problem for a user outside of the United States to use a US keyboard layout on a live system when trying out a distro? Can you try out a distro with a US keyboard layout without many problems?
I've tried several other keyboard layouts, and for the most part, they seem to follow the US keyboard layout (except for some special characters).
I'm looking at a keyboard switcher, but it only allows for three keyboard layouts.
Any input would be appreciated.

Yes, it is a VERY SERIOUS PROBLEM. many people will be unable to enter their names without accents, or domain names for web sites they need to refer to - possibly even the data needed to name their only available wifi AP.

In my case (English speaking UK keyboard user) 9/10 times, I will use my @ and ", and get the opposite - seriously annoying, but not fatal. However, I have several other keys which also do not type what is on them <> appear on the correct keys, but also on vertical bar and backslash. No backslash is reasonably close to fatal, no vertical bar can be fatal.

MiyoLinux · 2022-06-20 22:13:51

Andrwe wrote:

Yes, it is a VERY SERIOUS PROBLEM. many people will be unable to enter their names without accents, or domain names for web sites they need to refer to - possibly even the data needed to name their only available wifi AP.
In my case (English speaking UK keyboard user) 9/10 times, I will use my @ and ", and get the opposite - seriously annoying, but not fatal. However, I have several other keys which also do not type what is on them <> appear on the correct keys, but also on vertical bar and backslash. No backslash is reasonably close to fatal, no vertical bar can be fatal.

Thanks for the input Andrwe.

May I ask if your response has to do with MiyoLinux? I only ask, because this thread is very old. However, because of this thread, I coded a "Live Keyboard Layout" application for MiyoLinux...which allows non-US users to temporarily adopt their native keyboard layout in a MiyoLinux Live Session.

If that is the case,

1. Did you try the application from the "Welcome Screen" or from the menu?
2. If so, did the system fail to adopt your keyboard layout?

If so, please let me know so that I can look over the code.

If not, I apologize for my misunderstanding.

Camtaf · 2022-06-21 07:25:00

As long as the keyboard maps are included, using setxkbmap, (or loadkeys in commandline), can be used to get your layout.

Maybe a note to this effect at start up would suffice(?).

MiyoLinux · 2022-06-21 19:00:20

Thanks Camtaf.

There's a note on the Welcome Screen about the application and a button on the Welcome Screen to open the application. It uses setxkbmap to temporarily adopt the user's keyboard layout in the live session by clicking a button on the application after it opens

..although...

it does use US English spelling on the buttons in the application, I also have the country's national flag on each button too (in case that would help user's).

I was concerned if Andrwe was referring to MiyoLinux, because I know of several UK users, and they have reported that it works perfectly for them. So, if it wasn't working for Andrwe with UK English, I wanted to investigate further.

However, if Andrwe was just giving his view about systems not being able to provide the correct keyboard layout, then that's understandable, and I wanted Andrwe to know that.

Camtaf · 2022-06-22 07:09:44

Ah, right, haven't actually run MIYO since that weird green pukey back drop, (not sure how long ago that was).....

MiyoLinux · 2022-06-22 13:14:24

Camtaf wrote:

Ah, right, haven't actually run MIYO since that weird green pukey back drop, (not sure how long ago that was).....

Bwahahahaha!

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#1 2017-08-02 00:45:01

Advice needed from non-US users regarding keyboard layouts

#2 2017-08-02 01:36:05

Re: Advice needed from non-US users regarding keyboard layouts

#3 2017-08-02 03:16:30

Re: Advice needed from non-US users regarding keyboard layouts

#4 2017-08-02 19:41:54

Re: Advice needed from non-US users regarding keyboard layouts

#5 2017-08-02 21:55:12

Re: Advice needed from non-US users regarding keyboard layouts

#6 2017-08-02 22:07:10

Re: Advice needed from non-US users regarding keyboard layouts

#7 2017-08-03 09:31:32

Re: Advice needed from non-US users regarding keyboard layouts

#8 2017-08-03 18:44:15

Re: Advice needed from non-US users regarding keyboard layouts

#9 2017-08-16 02:21:05

Re: Advice needed from non-US users regarding keyboard layouts

#10 2017-08-16 02:49:21

Re: Advice needed from non-US users regarding keyboard layouts

#11 2022-06-20 18:46:10

Re: Advice needed from non-US users regarding keyboard layouts

#12 2022-06-20 22:13:51

Re: Advice needed from non-US users regarding keyboard layouts

#13 2022-06-21 07:25:00

Re: Advice needed from non-US users regarding keyboard layouts

#14 2022-06-21 19:00:20

Re: Advice needed from non-US users regarding keyboard layouts

#15 2022-06-22 07:09:44

Re: Advice needed from non-US users regarding keyboard layouts

#16 2022-06-22 13:14:24

Re: Advice needed from non-US users regarding keyboard layouts

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