lol!

greenjeans · 2017-11-10 00:33:55

golinux wrote:

greenjeans wrote:
golinux wrote:
LOL. After a sweaty day in 100 degree heat, I often strip on the front porch.
Hell I do that on 70 degree days. Usually sipping a beer.
At 70 degrees, I'm in a hoodie and down vest.

I'm gonna do the local polar bear plunge this year, but i'm gonna horrify my neighbors by doing it in a g-string, lololol! All for charity so they can't say squat.

fungus · 2017-11-10 09:26:19

golinux wrote:

There are only problems/puzzles and solutions. When there is no possible solution, the best course of action is to move on.

First nobody can easily be sure of any problem not having a solution, only accepting that not one can be found within reasonable time. Then again you are stuck into individualist thinking, where all problems are to the individual and must have individual solutions. If an individual solution can not be found the the individual "moves on", which means it accepts its individual fate and legitimizes the problem as a natural consequence. You are born without access to land, you are not a land owner, hence you move on being a passive slave as all individual slaves are. No individual could ever take land from the landowners. Except for maybe Zorro!

golinux wrote:

There is truth in this. Instant gratification and propaganda lower the bar for clear thinking and assessment of situations.

But the individualist mode of thinking is the result of propaganda and brainwashing, or should I say social conditioning which sounds less offensive. It is in the language, in religion, in anything we communicate socially. It is what keeps slaves as being slaves. The wealthy have created the state as a form of class organization and act collectively, they know better. They know why lack of social organization diminishes any power for the masses.

golinux wrote:

To be 'human' is by definition is to be 'flawed' ie. filled with conflicting impulses. Until that is sorted with very careful observation there is no clarity, peace or end to the misery.

So first we should become superhuman as Nitsche said, then we will deal with our slavemasters. Till then we should move on to the field and keep picking cotton eternally blaming ourselves for our "inner flaws". The flawed should never raise their sight up to the unflawed slavemaster.

Freedom is one bite at the aorta away!

golinux wrote:

This is so true. And that's what it will take for our consumer culture to wake up. It's going to be some ride when reality sets in . . .

As long as we believe it is a culture and a flaw of the individual and as it can not be changed we should move on, it will never change till the last human dies on the deserted earth. It is not a culture, it is a system. This behavior is very well defined within the system of material conditions fabricated by the masters.
Simple math and physics. Finite planet, resources, finite limit of life it could support. If you restrict the planet, control resources, limit where life can be supported and where it can't, deplete resources unnecessarily to create scarcity, ... etc etc... you get a small bunch of self serving consumers around the palace walls, while the remaining starve to death outside the castle. It is no culture, it is artificial cannibalism that serves the interests of 0.1% of the earth's population, while there is a 10% whose consumerism aligns with the interests of the 0.1%.
The only thing that has changed since mid-last-century, is that the geography of the distribution has changed. There is a third world in every big city in the west, and there is a Zurich or MonteCarlo in every city in the ex-3rd world. Things are more stable this way.
Consumerism is a tool for the necessity of the 10% protecting the palace and the castle. Do you think rural Peruvians suffer from consumerism?

Burn the castle "LoLLLLL"

golinux wrote:

PS. I have some beautiful wild 'shrooms in the woods.

Re: PS No, there is no such thing as wild and tamed mushroom. You have mushrooms that is the only way you could possibly have woods. The mushroom for the small portion of fungi that have a visible one, is the genetic organ of the fungus. When we stop seeing mushrooms in the woods, or bees, ... etc, it is time to take those euthanasia pills because time is up. Their spores will stick around for after the extinction event to reform new life, if Kim Trump and Putin don't blow the whole rock in pieces. Spores can even travel in space in the pores of a rock. Possibly that is how they came here too. What is the largest and longest living organism on earth? One single fungus for miles away under a forest in Oregon, thousands of years old, "that we know of".

PS2 A fungal network may look chaotic, it has no head, beginning or end, all cells are equal and in total communication and harmony with all cells, even when they are miles away from each other. One DNA across all of it. The same fungus may seem parasitic to one plant sucking juices away, feeding another tree that is lacking resources. Why is a coral reef a center of sea life and biodiversity? How come about 20 species of fungi that we know of contain remedies for almost all lethal diseases for animals? Why don't we see it in our pharmacies or have doctors prescribe them? Why do we cut down one of the most important rainforests (In Equador now) to dig for metals, to feed consumers with gadgets? Why do we drill through a coral reef to find oil/gas?
Not because we are individually flawed, but because we have collectively allowed the system of death and destruction to go on and on and on till the planet is dead.

Make love AND go to war with the bosses.
PEACE, by any means necessary as Malcolm had once said. Well, no, I don't agree with the "by any means", we should still save some humanity and dignity for after the war is over or it is not worth it.

cynwulf · 2017-11-10 10:12:38

fungus wrote:

It is a bit out of my water and knowledge base. Some people swear by the importance of open source.
I sit down and write some clean good code and you review it and say it is great. Then you run it through a compiler and produce a nice speedy binary package. How safe is this binary. How reliable are available compilers. Can we know?

They can be safe, we can know that, but it's whether we choose to know or not.

Originally, projects such as GNU and BSD, etc were written by "hackers for hackers" at UC Berkeley and MIT and some other academic institutions. The originally BSD style "permissive" licences were very simple in that they basically allowed code to be used for anything, without any real restriction so long as a copy of the licence was included.

GNU/Linux changed this in that it created a launch platform for Stallman's GPL and ideology. GNU/Linux displaced BSD as the main contender for a free UNIX-like OS, not because it was superior, but because at the time FreeBSD, NetBSD and proprietary BSD/OS were still encumbered with AT&T code and BSDi were facing the USL lawsuit.

The Berkeley hackers who worked on BSD (which was originally based on licensed AT&T UNIX code) were not really motivated by Stallmanist ideology or corporate gain but by wanting to hack and by pragmatism - i.e. make something which works, works better than the alternatives and let others use it and appreciate that.

The current state of affairs is very different indeed - in that "Linux" (as a catch all) is not being "produced" for hackers by hackers, but by "developers" for consumers.

A quick comparison of the Linux Foundation and FreeBSD foundation websites will give at least an idea of what has come to be. On the former we see paid employees of IBM, HP, Red Hat, Samsung, etc - in short "corporate reps". On the latter we see that the majority are much the same types of academics as they have always been.

When the end user, even if they weren't a hacker, even if they were merely a tinkerer or someone with 15% understanding of a given system, even as someone who could and was prepared to actually configure their own system or submit a bug or patch something and rebuilt it from source, surrenders into becoming a "consumer", they effectively give up all the real benefits of FOSS and may as well switch to a proprietary product and be treated like a consumer.

With this in mind, the compiler being trusted, poisoned, etc becomes irrelevant (and by the way it's entirely possible to compromise a compiler so that it "poisons" specific code) as the "consumer" only wants a working end product.

When you consider that Linus Torvalds has publicly stated that he doesn't actually care about security and that the kernel is too big to audit, the compiler also seems irrelevant.

fungus wrote:

If after all this trouble, struggle, to learn and operate a linux system, we end up just like running w10 (in terms of privacy and security) I would rather shoot my better leg. The more I learn the less likely it seems that the trip is worth it. I may sound just like one of those systemd trolls, that win10 is not that bad after all, but I can't help it.

We hear it often:

" $LINUX_SOFTWARE_XYZ works for me"

MS Windows also "works for me". As hard as it may be for some to grasp: Yes it really does just work - I can testify to that. It may have some serious shortcomings, but it certainly works and works very well. Do I like it? No. I use it at work, no choice, but wouldn't have it in my home.

As most people seem to miss or choose to ignore. The world of GNU/Linux, the major distributions and the big software projects are now very much in the hands of corporations. In my opinion Stallman's approach failed because the corporations simply bought off or employed the individuals involved in these projects, making them "free" only in licence, not in spirit.

fungus wrote:

Now, in the same poor excuse of a state, they are making it necessary to get a permanent ID for mass transit by in-person registration that has to be used as a sliding a card in every bus and metro/rail thing you enter, even if the charge is a single trip. This is like having an antenna on your butt what time you went where. At some point you start doubting whether it was you deciding to go somewhere and do something or you are part of a remote control system executing orders.

This has been the case in London for many years. All tube and bus travel is "cashless" and RFID based technology is used. This means that every person and their movements within the public transport system are traceable.

Last edited by cynwulf (2017-11-10 10:13:53)

MiyoLinux · 2017-11-10 10:51:25

cynwulf wrote:

BSD

cynwulf, if I may ask (and if you don't mind answering), what is your view/impression of GhostBSD?

cynwulf · 2017-11-10 11:03:46

I have no real opinion, it's a FreeBSD based "desktop oriented" OS as far as I'm aware?

I'm not sure of how it differs in implementation or goals to others such as TrueOS (formerly PC-BSD). My experience is limited to OpenBSD, FreeBSD, Dragonfly BSD and very little with NetBSD. Zero with all others.

MiyoLinux · 2017-11-10 11:14:53

cynwulf wrote:

I have no real opinion, it's a FreeBSD based "desktop oriented" OS as far as I'm aware?
I'm not sure of how it differs in implementation or goals to others such as TrueOS (formerly PC-BSD). My experience is limited to OpenBSD, FreeBSD, Dragonfly BSD and very little with NetBSD. Zero with all others.

Okay. Thank you.

fungus · 2017-11-10 11:32:55

cynwulf wrote:

They can be safe, we can know that, but it's whether we choose to know or not.
.........
When you consider that Linus Torvalds has publicly stated that he doesn't actually care about security and that the kernel is too big to audit, the compiler also seems irrelevant.

The user delegates power, thus freedom, to the experts (developers), to judge what is safe and clean.
Everything is OK as everyone else around thinks it is ok.
As you say, if I interpret the two sentences correctly, and I believe it is true, nobody individually could possibly audit line by line, a linux kernel, a compiler, firefox, or wordpress, or even X, and since they work and everyone is using them, the experts have sent their blessings, nobody discovers an intentional security flaw (systemd zero), we assume that we are not dummies on a dummy terminal bigsister has provided for us, consumers.

Auditing takes (wo)manpower and (wo)manhours, which in this world (that can't be changed so we should just move on according to our friend goL) this takes money. Enormous amount of money flawing and enormous amount of hours working and cleaning code. This takes organization. How come we can trust such an organization? How do we know their faith in our ideals, principles, values, will remain in tact? We don't, not within the sphere of this economic system we can't. It has to be done outside this sphere, under different social relations and material conditions. Paid labor separated those who pay and those who get paid and their interests will never be the same.

And I believe this is a cross point between the two parallel discussions we have developed under the LoL topic.
Nothing good, healthy, or a solution, can come out while still living inside the sphere of death and destruction.
We must enter the sphere of life and construction to find common solutions to our common problems.

Time to order pizza with smoked buffalo strips and sun dried mango, rinsed by beer from mount Olympus, chased by Equadorian rum.
All this talk and writing got me hungry.

I wouldn't change a thing as long as the pizza keeps coming.

cynwulf · 2017-11-10 11:56:04

There is the approach of "proactive security", code auditing and general "code correction" principles as embraced by the OpenBSD project. The general principle of "if there are too many lines to audit the code is garbage and needs to go" holds sway here rather than just piling on more and more raw functionality in a scenario of continual code bloat, while just pretending it's all ok. Those submitting crap are pretty much told as such. Theo de Raadt, the lead developer was once described by Linux Torvalds as "difficult". Unlike many, Theo is into what he does best and is not some corporate whore in the pockets of big business.

The Linux kernel is about 25 million lines of code. The whole of OpenBSD, kernel + userland is only about 3 million, as I recall. Security is the main focus with OpenBSD and new security features are being constantly developed. With this attitude "that the OS is still not secure enough", it can only improve rather than stagnating as some others have. I can only say good things about it, having used it for a few years, but it's not for the fainthearted "Linux desktop user". YMMV.

golinux · 2017-11-10 15:11:40

@fungus . . . I give up. We are obviously talking past each other because our points of reference are in parallel universes.

(and you'd rather argue than listen)

fungus · 2017-11-10 15:44:32

No problem, there is nothing here to spoil our day.

I do listen, to solid logical arguments and facts. I actually pursue better arguments than mine. Do you see me arguing with cynwulf? I stand corrected in most counts.

I refuse all theology as nonsense.

I know of one universe, the one that till this day is recognized by mainstream science (the vast community of scientists). It is not a conscious decision to argue, but I have to accept an argument as superior to mine and incorporate it into my thinking or I would have to contest it and present a counter argument. If there is one reality there can not be two conflicting theories about it and both be right. But what is to argue when the opponent says that each one of us has a different reality? Perception maybe, reality no. If there was more than one reality the universe would probably collapse out of its own contradiction. If you want to paint an alternative reality, free of the guilt of the consequences, and you can, who am I to stop you.

I hear that in places with sub-zero temperature there exist swimming pools in open air roof tops that have 30'C by having heater blowers on top separating the cold air from the hot air. They do have them because they can.

Consumers on the other hand can reach up the shelf grab a different reality, customize it to fit, and be civil with each other having different ones. Then they can smoke a joint and see yet more realities.
Should I listen and shut up or should I criticize and analyze? Sorry I can't accept the claim that there are purple elephants in the orange sky floating and that are real and alive.

But then someone in charge could ban me from the forum and there would be no more arguing, or debating, or disagreement. Things would return to normalcy. LoL!!! And I do appreciate not being banned for arguing too much. Don't think that I don't.

PS Is there any pizza left?

golinux · 2017-11-10 16:12:32

Thinking is a trap that will only give you a headache. Be here now and you might just find that things are quite something else . . .

cynwulf · 2017-11-10 16:28:48

golinux wrote:

@fungus . . . I give up[etc]

Stop being so anti-fungal!

golinux · 2017-11-10 16:37:57

@cynwulf . . . You two are a perfect match. Have at it. I am not anti-fungal. All these rantings are just irrelevant (to me).

cynwulf · 2017-11-10 17:08:12

fungus is my alt account...

Really, do you need the [funny][/funny] tags extension installed?

fungus · 2017-11-10 20:41:05

Or would you rather install the [LoL][/lOl] tags extension?

I think the NSA supercomputer's systemd just went into an infinite loop.

If user cynwulf = fungus kill Pid 1

The officially official Devuan Forum!

#51 2017-11-10 00:33:55

Re: lol!

#52 2017-11-10 09:26:19

Re: lol!

#53 2017-11-10 10:12:38

Re: lol!

#54 2017-11-10 10:51:25

Re: lol!

#55 2017-11-10 11:03:46

Re: lol!

#56 2017-11-10 11:14:53

Re: lol!

#57 2017-11-10 11:32:55

Re: lol!

#58 2017-11-10 11:56:04

Re: lol!

#59 2017-11-10 15:11:40

Re: lol!

#60 2017-11-10 15:44:32

Re: lol!

#61 2017-11-10 16:12:32

Re: lol!

#62 2017-11-10 16:28:48

Re: lol!

#63 2017-11-10 16:37:57

Re: lol!

#64 2017-11-10 17:08:12

Re: lol!

#65 2017-11-10 20:41:05

Re: lol!

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