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#1 2022-02-11 16:26:15

k3yw0ow
Member
Registered: 2022-02-08
Posts: 21  

The best init system

Hi, everyone!

I am in doubt to choose which init is best for my system, recently I have abandoned systemd and am quite layman about alternative inits.

I saw that according to https://www.devuan.org/os/init-freedom there are eight inits available in Devuan, however, in your Gitea repository Epoch additional packages are shown.

Which system init is the best choice?

Thanks.

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#2 2022-02-11 16:35:30

andyprough
Member
Registered: 2019-10-19
Posts: 235  

Re: The best init system

Use the one that's the default for the distro you are using - that's the one that will get the most love and attention from the distro's developers, and will give you the most trouble-free experience. On Devuan and antiX and Slackware, that's sysvinit. On Artix, that's openrc. On Void, that's runit.


Primary Computer - Commodore 64: Processor - MOS 6510/8500, 1.023MHz; Memory - 64kb RAM, 20kB ROM - 8k BASIC V2, 8k Kernel, 4k Character ROM; Display output - 320x200, 16 colours; OS - BASIC V2.0; Weight: 1.8kg

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#3 2022-02-11 18:03:40

Head_on_a_Stick
Member
From: London
Registered: 2019-03-24
Posts: 2,326  

Re: The best init system

I like OpenRC because it's easy to manage with rc-update & rc-status.


To obtain a root shell use su -. Using just su will result in "command not found" messages.

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#4 2022-02-13 03:06:43

zapper
Member
Registered: 2017-05-29
Posts: 432  

Re: The best init system

If s6-init becomes lighter than even runit,  maybe that?

If not, Runit is a good one.

Just need to learn how to use it better. Haven't felt the motivation as much to learn due to it being not finished on Hyperbola, but I use it alot on Devuan.

wink

Openrc is the probably the most userfriendly so far? I think?

If s6 is more user friendly and lighter on the system, meaning less battery power used, I may have more interest.

All that being said, currently runit is the fastest I have seen, and uses  the least ram and I think also CPU.

But if you want an easy one, do not use runit unless you look at how to use it and feel like you understand it enough.

Some apps need to autostart aka after you logout, others need to always be on and some should only be on when you want them on. 

Anywho my two cents.

Last edited by zapper (2022-02-13 03:08:12)


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#5 2022-02-13 11:47:25

Geoff 42
Member
Registered: 2016-12-15
Posts: 416  

Re: The best init system

If your main interest is in having a running system, then go with the default, SysVinit, in the case of Devuan.

If you are interested in playing with the init system, or you are running a service which must be kept going, then Runit and OpenRC are interesting and can supervise the services.
OpenRC is probably easier for setting up new services, with its declarative style of script.
Runit seems to get rave reviews from people who understand the internals, but it does require setting up a directory structure for each service.

It depends a bit on how they are installed, as both Runit and OpenRC can be installed to be started from SysVinit, which takes its initial instructions from /etc/inittab. Runit can add an entry at the end on inittab :-

#-- runit begin
SV:123456:respawn:/etc/runit/2
#-- runit end

While OpenRC replaces /etc/init.d/rcS and /etc/init.d/rc, which are called from inittab.

Both Runit and OpenRC can replace the SysV init, in which case inittab is not referenced.
This has the effect that the gettys would not be started and they must be set up using the features of your new init system. If you install them from scratch, then this may have already been taken care of.

The Runit init does seem to work well.
I did have problems with the OpenRC init, resulting in the system not being shutdown cleanly, so that the file systems needed checking at boot time. When it boots from SysV init, it has an extra run state to pass through and this work nicely and the system shuts cleanly.
I have tried patching the OpenRC init to add this extra run state, but I failed to pursuade the Debian maintainers on this point.

https://dev1galaxy.org/viewtopic.php?id=2788
with details of the patching here :-
https://dev1galaxy.org/viewtopic.php?pid=21180#p21180

Geoff

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#6 2022-02-13 12:41:54

hevidevi
Member
Registered: 2021-09-17
Posts: 223  

Re: The best init system

I generally stick with the default init the operating system comes with, for Devuan this is i believe sysvinit. But i do like openrc and use it on artixlinux and more recently on alpine linux. Overall all though i believe openrc is one of the better inits out there imo.

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#7 2022-02-14 06:55:08

xinomilo
Member
Registered: 2017-07-02
Posts: 229  

Re: The best init system

i would probably share the same 2 cents as @zapper..

been sticking with runit for the last year or so, because it feels so much faster to boot.
one of the cons, i think it's the different way it's implemented across distros.. not easy to get same results as devuan/debian, antix, artix, void, use it differently.. (even though i think antix lately resembled the artix way?). would prefer a similar set of files/scripts across distros, also in order to share missing scripts and make it more widely used, but..., anyway..

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#8 2022-02-14 17:27:54

rolfie
Member
Registered: 2017-11-25
Posts: 643  

Re: The best init system

I am using openrc since ASCII.

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#9 2022-02-15 03:08:23

GlennW
Member
Registered: 2019-07-18
Posts: 227  

Re: The best init system

I'm using openrc as well, since ascii. I find it easy to manage.

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#10 2022-02-15 07:41:16

Andre4freedom
Member
Registered: 2017-11-15
Posts: 57  

Re: The best init system

I agree, OpenRC is the logical choice:
It's easy to use,
It's very effective
It's maintainable and transparent
And, it's mostly compatible with old init scripts
I have used it from the beginning with Devuan and it never failed me.

It does one job and does it well
All this in a very true UNIX manner

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#11 2022-02-15 08:42:39

blackhole
Member
Registered: 2020-03-16
Posts: 65  

Re: The best init system

Unless your writing your own rc scrips / services / unit files, I'm not sure why you'd care.

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#12 2022-02-15 13:43:15

Head_on_a_Stick
Member
From: London
Registered: 2019-03-24
Posts: 2,326  

Re: The best init system

^ I still get confused with sysvinit when it comes to enabling and disabling services and also with checking if they are actually enabled, which is why I prefer OpenRC or systemd with their more straightforward management tools.

For my ROCK Pi S switching Debian from systemd to runit (with runit-init as PID 1) saves a significant amount of memory on a device which only has 512MiB to spare.

There are also the inherent advantages conferred by moving to a smaller code base, which is especially relevant when comparing systemd with OpenRC, runit or s6: less code == less potential for bugs to creep in. Theoretical, granted, but still a factor.

EDIT: *you're tongue

And here's a comparison of the binary sizes for the Debian bullseye/Devuan chimaera versions:

$ ls -l lib/{systemd/systemd,runit/runit-init} sbin/{openrc-,}init
-rwxr-xr-x 1 empty empty   18760 Jul 25  2021 lib/runit/runit-init
-rwxr-xr-x 1 empty empty 1739200 Jul 13  2021 lib/systemd/systemd
-rwxr-xr-x 1 empty empty   52240 Apr 18  2021 sbin/init # sysvinit
-rwxr-xr-x 1 empty empty   22520 Apr  2  2021 sbin/openrc-init
$

Last edited by Head_on_a_Stick (2022-02-16 20:31:46)


To obtain a root shell use su -. Using just su will result in "command not found" messages.

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#13 2022-02-16 14:45:20

EDX-0
Member
Registered: 2020-12-12
Posts: 32  

Re: The best init system

i'd say sysvinit but i am biased from old linux and since sysvinit scripts can be rather simple when you want something that just works without using the lsb stuff.


no life matters, no life ever will, for existing is not something to be proud of but grateful, only achievements matter.

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#14 2022-03-13 15:36:59

rhtoras
Member
Registered: 2020-12-25
Posts: 4  

Re: The best init system

I prefer all systems except systemD. Runit is the best for desktop use. On the other hand openrc is popular and widely used. SysVinit is old but i can say it just works and a lot distributions still use it. There is also s6 which is also very good and powerfull but on the other hand very difficult for me.

Last edited by rhtoras (2022-03-13 15:37:31)

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#15 2022-03-13 22:07:23

andyprough
Member
Registered: 2019-10-19
Posts: 235  

Re: The best init system

rhtoras wrote:

I prefer all systems except systemD.

Did you mean to say Soystem-D?


Primary Computer - Commodore 64: Processor - MOS 6510/8500, 1.023MHz; Memory - 64kb RAM, 20kB ROM - 8k BASIC V2, 8k Kernel, 4k Character ROM; Display output - 320x200, 16 colours; OS - BASIC V2.0; Weight: 1.8kg

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#16 2022-03-14 11:30:04

hevidevi
Member
Registered: 2021-09-17
Posts: 223  

Re: The best init system

andyprough wrote:
rhtoras wrote:

I prefer all systems except systemD.

Did you mean to say Soystem-D?

Head on a sticK really dislikes when you spell systemd incorrectly lmao.

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#17 2022-03-14 15:57:44

golinux
Administrator
Registered: 2016-11-25
Posts: 2,503  

Re: The best init system

Don'cha know that the kiddies have to be stoopiD . . .

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#18 2022-03-15 03:17:17

EDX-0
Member
Registered: 2020-12-12
Posts: 32  

Re: The best init system

g'day m8, shoitstemd is crap m8, install sysvinit m8.


no life matters, no life ever will, for existing is not something to be proud of but grateful, only achievements matter.

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#19 2022-03-15 05:08:28

golinux
Administrator
Registered: 2016-11-25
Posts: 2,503  

Re: The best init system

This thread has reached a new and embarrassing low in Devuan history . . . grow up . . .

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