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#1 Re: News & Announcements » The (almost) No Code of Conduct » 2018-06-17 11:02:29

Dutch_Master wrote:

I'd raise the threshold for defining a troll a little to, say, 5. A true troll will annoy enough members to meet this figure, but it will not falsely accuse a member who has a disagreement with one or more others about trivial, or controversial, matters.

In 15th century Spain someone who would publicly advocate that the earth is a sphere, if he could escape the inquisition, they would match this definition of a troll.  But there are countless other examples where this definition would fail miserably.

The real issue is whether this communication mode that is implemented can be applied in true physical relations and communication.  Can you shut someone up in a group and stay within a group?  If you start slipping more and more to where your digital communication deviates more and more to the mode of physical communication then this mode will affect the social relations you and everyone has outside wires and radiowaves.  Sociologically this has a tremendous significance, and maybe I should be speaking in past tense already..  Is it my perception or do we know people who are very polite and popular in social media but in real life they are monsters that nobody cares to talk to, and vise versa.  The importance here is not on one to one communication, but communication within a group, family, work, school, neighborhood, etc.

I am not implying there is a fault at this specific policy or there is a better one, but how we tend to deviate from being social beings to being social media beings, isolated in tiny little cults made of electrons.  Emphasis on the freedom of isolation, therefore the freedom to depart from humanity.

It is a sad state of affairs anyway you want to look at it.  The internet has given the ability to everyone to become a little dictator and shut anyone off.  At some point we have to make the distinction on whether we are part of the engineers or part of what is being engineered.  We are legitimizing any oppressive regime in doing exactly what we individually do.  And that is OK?

#2 Re: Installation » repository changed its 'Origin' value [SOLVED] » 2018-06-02 09:10:36

Dear D1rs, as of yesterday, the "Origin:" field in the Release and InRelease files on and has been set to "Devuan" (it was empty before). This should most probably solve several issues related to incomplete or wrong information retrieved (openly or silently) by lsb_release. This includes also a few cases in which Devuan is not correctly "recognised" as a host system.

The change seems to be seamless, even if some users have reported that apt in Beowulf would issue a warning about that: you can safely ignore the warning, and ask apt to continue. Please report any issue with this change. HND KatolaZ

Obviously it is not seamless and you can't just ignore it with apt, you have to say yes for every repository in order to continue, OR YOU CAN NOT continue.  On apt-get it is not even telling you what to adjust and where, just DOES NOT continue and there is NO WAY to continue.

Just so we can set the record straight with what is what!

#3 Re: Installation » repository changed its 'Origin' value [SOLVED] » 2018-06-02 07:52:28

So the only logical explanation of why you wouldn't get those error messages is if you had that field set to devuan in advance?

This practice of "setting things" then make an announcement days later is a pattern with Devuan as it is making announcements on the list pretending there was no issue brought up on the forum.

#4 Re: Installation » repository changed its 'Origin' value [SOLVED] » 2018-05-31 22:01:56

Why is this like de-ja-vue to me?
FSMR, are you implying those two other users are making it up?  The error messages I mean?

1 possible scenario is that they are running beowulf, and you are running ascii, so is it possible that your apt and apt-get is a different version than theirs (and corresponding libraries maybe?)
2 I have a feeling this is a mixup in the ascii (testing --> stable) beowulf (unstable --> testing) buster (testing) transition.
3  Your implication that the same repositories, the same procedure, returns different results is a serious one.  I think you should look into it.  I would say no more!

#5 Re: Forum Feedback » Enough is enough (and then the other hand claps) » 2018-05-16 00:54:55

but for a week when Golinux was arguing with her friend about me being banned I couldn't participate and it took that friend of Golinux 2-3 days to realize why I wasn't participating in the topic I had started, while it was being chopped and moved in various corners of the forum.

But she is right, nobody has been banned (it is a legal statement authorized by the legal department).
Stop spreading legally inaccurate lies figos!

Ohhh... One question.
Is an unbanned person really free to express his/her views?  After what systemd did with the word free ...  hey might as well use it for toilet  paper these days.

#6 Re: Forum Feedback » Enough is enough (and then the other hand claps) » 2018-05-16 00:48:28


I am living proof!

#7 Re: Off-topic » The Joke Thread » 2018-05-14 10:39:38

Hey, I got a good one, I dedicate it to @greenjeans

A guy walks into a computer store
- He asks for a secure browser he can run noscript on
- The salesman says, I make the most secure browser, it is called palemoon, but you shouldn't run noscript on it as it causing instability with the browser and breaks some pages.
- But if I can't run the industry's leading script blocker on it why do you call it secure?
and the salesman says:
- Sometimes I forget!

Ok, I know, it is not very funny, it is actually not funny at all!

#8 Re: DIY » Tips for using Palemoon » 2018-03-19 19:13:11

TorBrowser offers a sandboxed-browser and on its configuration you are asked whether and which directories outside the sb is the program allowed to access or to specify a sandboxed folder where you can place things before and retrieve things after.  It even asks you whether you want audio/visual drivers enabled within the sb to isolate it even more.  Even a task manager run inside a sandbox can not even see the system but a fake one.  It seems as firejail has slackened stuff up and made defaults of a more liberal sb system.  It was stricter on those things when it started.  It seems also that TB sb project has been placed in storage and is not developing lately.

There is also "containers"  like lxc which may interest you

#9 Re: News & Announcements » Devuan 2.0 ASCII Beta is here! » 2018-02-20 13:45:00

gksu gksudo will be removed from debian repositories.  It already has been removed from debian-testing/buster and exists in stretch and sid.  The excuse is it is unmaintained, the truth may be that the gnome team wants its polkit to be handling things and not gksu.
Is gksudo synaptic and gksudo gparted (as menu items) the same process as synaptic.pkexec and gparted.pkexec ?
I don't think so.  I bet the same gnome team people don't like lxpolkit being independent of their polkit.  If you have lxpolkit running I bet the same menu items that don't work will.

#11 Re: Devuan Derivatives » Grub Background fix for Miyo-XTRA-Ascii 2018 » 2018-02-13 17:52:18

No, thank you, I'll keep it miyo.   Grub is usually on one of them, sometimes I may run into trouble and use a different one, but since I've put Devuan (and its derivatives) in the freezer till the act gets together someday, I will use miyo in some other installation.
Void or Obarun probably smile

#12 Re: Devuan Derivatives » Grub Background fix for Miyo-XTRA-Ascii 2018 » 2018-02-13 15:38:49

This is good, it is going on all my installations

#13 Re: Installation » pkgmaster is repository hell (continued) » 2018-02-06 13:01:08

This is what I was saying, up to about 10 days ago and intemittendly for a couple of months they were giving different results, meaning that there were things missing from one and that they couldn't have been the same.  Take a look at what it was doing when OpenRC moved to ascii.  Then when miyo-extra came out 2-3 installations were destroyed by this.  The installation on two boxes was fine and fully updated, then switch just the names of the repositories to ...onion and it was like going from jessie to ceres, before I knew it half the system was gone and wouldn't even respond to chroot, never mind booting.

I'm just glad that out of this "someone" went and fixed something even though *he will not admit to it.
I'm just done here due to trust, of people telling me that I am nuts instead of looking at the problem.
Thos who use tor, for whatever reason, are not usually talkative or subscribe to forums and lists.  So just because nobody else is reporting anything doesn't say much about the state of things.

Anyway, thank you for your time.

#14 Re: Other Issues » Unable to format sdcard » 2018-02-05 21:56:13

Try creating a new partition table --> msdos
After that is done, you can recreate a partition and formatted in any format.  Sometimes gparted is too dumb and too afraid to wipe everything out and those cards are a little mysteriously structured.

#15 Re: Other Issues » How to fix the meltdown and spectre issue in Devuan » 2018-02-05 21:03:50

They haven't just pulled, they said whoever made the mistake of applying it is screwed, in nicer terms.  But some distributions still have the 01/18 microcode available.

#16 Re: Installation » pkgmaster is repository hell (continued) » 2018-02-05 18:32:27

I have used tor:// instead of tor+http:// for years because I have proved to my self that there is not a bit of difference.  I actually threw it in there as bate so the innocent can get caught on the hook.

Try again because there has been 0 answer still.
Ralph's response appears as an answer of how things are working "now", not how they have been working.  It was within hours/days Katolaz responded on DNZ that ....onion is equal to pkgmaster, and GoLinux copied this response here about the same day.  Look up amprolla3 announcement and you will find the statement as I say shortly after, if you care.  It was since then that 3 or 4 ascii installation broke because of the difference between the "two" different things.  I would care more about why this is the case than about responding to me and shutting me up.  I am glad if after months of complaining somebody was lead to go fix it even though it may not be admittable that it was a mistake and it is now fixed.
Try tor and tor+http and let me know how is it different or supposed to be different.
Unfortunately I have lost interest in trying anymore.  It is not worth my time, despite of how much I will miss three people in here and I have not altered my signature and stand behind their efforts.

#17 Re: Installation » pkgmaster is repository hell (continued) » 2018-02-05 02:17:40

deb tor://devuanfwojg73k6r.onion/merged ascii main contrib non-free
deb tor://devuanfwojg73k6r.onion/merged ascii-updates  main contrib non-free
deb tor://devuanfwojg73k6r.onion/merged ascii-security main contrib non-free
# deb tor:// ascii main contrib non-free
# deb tor:// ascii-updates  main contrib non-free
# deb tor:// ascii-security main contrib non-free

This is what I was alternating back and forth and getting different results with about 4 installations.
The last two I tried on the same day with pkgmaster they were all up to date and there was nothing to upgrade.
Switching the comment from bottom three to top three, the release files had to reload as new, and a whole bunch of things had to be changed like it was shifting from one distro to another.  When the process was done the installation was all broken and couldn't boot or chroot to, due to essential pkgs being removed.

But what is the point of asking.  Are you trying to get an answer or an excuse that it is my fault.  I did the same thing in debian, and the release files do not reload as they have the same gpg key, because their onion address points to the same repository, not a different one!

Is devuanfwojg73k6r.onion = ?

That is all you need to answer.  I have stated the same problem about 10 times already, why is it so damn hard for you or katolaz to comprehend?
And you do not need to answer to me, but the body of devuan users, because if there is no technically rational explanation none should trust devuan anymore!

#18 Re: Installation » pkgmaster is repository hell (continued) » 2018-02-04 16:51:19

I have not questioned the transport protocol but the address itself.  Obviously the onion address can only be reached through tor by either tor://.....onion or tor+http://,,,,,onion

I am clearly questioning whether the onion address and the pkgmaster is the same as all evidence was pointing to not being the same.  For example see the thread with OpenRC on ascii.  Just switching the address from pkgmaster to onion OpenRC had insufficient pkg available.  Dependencies were missing all over the place and I had reported them.  Fsmithred said he had no clue why that would be.  I told him then that the only possible explanations was that using the same exact repositories with the onion address and with pkgmaster gave different results.  Which I tried later with another installation and it was pretty obvious.  My first try was with ceres and ceres covered the dependencies for the missing ones from ascii.

Hitting tor://pkgmaster yes, you go into the tor network and back out to clearnet to pkgmaster.  Pkgmaster server sees the exit node ip, and the transfer is through socks5.  That is not what the problem is.  Obviously dns provides the same ip for pkgmaster whether you go through tor or http or https.

Again is devuanfwojg73k6r.onion the same server as and if so since when?

"This site can be mentioned as “dev dash 1 dot org” as it is reached via and

To avoid censorship and blocks to the Internet, this website is also accessible using Tor at the address http://devuanzuwu3xoqwp.onion"

We provide access to our package repository also via Tor: install apt-transport-tor and then use the following hidden services

deb tor+http://devuanfwojg73k6r.onion/merged jessie          main
deb tor+http://devuanfwojg73k6r.onion/merged jessie-updates  main
deb tor+http://devuanfwojg73k6r.onion/merged jessie-security main


#19 Installation » pkgmaster is repository hell (continued) » 2018-02-04 14:26:32

Replies: 11

It was brought to my attention that my prohibition to post here has ended.  This is my first try to post ever since the "Post Reply" button reappeared.
I would very much like to engage and participate in the above and other discussions but this would have been a trap to undermine the reasons for which I was put in isolation, even though we all are still prisoners of the administrators.

The question remains.  Is and has the onion address of the repository been forwarded to pkgmaster as announced by golinux and katolaz or is it (and has been in the recent past and ever since the announcement of pkgmaster) another repository with supposedly the same content?  This is a question that is not personal in anyway but relevant to anyone wishing to try devuan.

As a non-personal issue it should have been anyone's issue to forward to the "appropriate channels".  I chose to use the "officially official" devuan forum.
As far as I know this question has not been answered by devuan "officially".  If and when this question is answered then I would be willing to discuss "other" matters.  Till then, it all appears to me as an escape from answering the question above.  Has Devuan been deceiving its users or not?  I think it is important.

#20 Re: Forum Feedback » Crossing the line or not? » 2018-01-27 03:34:10

Your mail to 'Dng' with the subject Fw: Reply to topic: 'pkgmaster is repository hell' Is being held until the list moderator can review it for approval. The reason it is being held: Post by non-member to a members-only list Either the message will get posted to the list, or you will receive notification of the moderator's decision. If you would like to cancel this posting, please visit the following URL: … 91fc67c78c

#21 Forum Feedback » Crossing the line or not? » 2018-01-27 03:25:29

Replies: 17

Note that the following posts were split from this topic.


You see this is what I am talking about, deviate from the issue.

Show me ONE comment where someone has tried what I prescribe above and reported back as positive or negative in reproducing the problem.

NOT ONCE IN MONTHS has anyone said that what I claim is false or it is true!!!

Keep on keeping on golinux. keep sweeping things under the carpet.

#22 Re: Installation » pkgmaster is repository hell » 2018-01-27 02:54:33

Cynwulf, I don't disagree with much of what you say, but there has been evidence on systemd being a little more than just not "as functional as it claims", or becoming a monolyth mediator between linux and all other software.  It  is about security.  And that becomes automatically political, whether it relates to user and big corporations or the user and the state.

On the whining part the fault is not always on the user side but how users are treated by developers and the distance they form between themselves and users.
When the repository is malfunctioning there is not much a user "can" do, it is not a technical problem or a bug.  If it keeps happening time and time again and either there is no feedback, or there is a 'I don't see a problem with it" eventually whining and complaining is all one can do.  I like to think that I am not the only user using this repository, I am just the one talking about it, open and in public.

But why go off-topic on all those other issues and not talk about the problem.  No matter what version of devuan you (not cynwulf the resto of you all) you don't have to upgrade anything, just hit the repository like I am saying and update.  See whether it checks out.  Even trying ceres should make no difference.  If things that are meant to be identical and are different is where the problem begins.

Golinux:  I am tired of dealing with autistic people.  When I say A you say go to DNG.  When I say I am blocked by DNG you change the subject.  Then I talk about the subject and you come back telling me to go to DNG!  The one day you say that is where the developers are, the next day you get offended and call me clueless because I say that you are not a developer! 

If you don't think the matter is serious, just say so!  If you think the matter IS serious then I believe you have an obligation to convey the message since you are larking on there all day anyway.

http: repositories are like buying insulin from a street smuggler.
The way you are dealing with the repeated report of the problem is what gets me overly suspicious!

And you know I will not let it rest

A month ago I was testing Refracta 9, I reported the problem I was having (installing OpenRC)  to fsmithred and he couldn't reproduce it.  The only difference was the tor address of the repository.  The next day, without changing the source list at all the missing dependencies all of a sudden reappeared and were available,.
I had shown the output of all the missing pkgs that magically reappeared the day after.

I may have done more installations of Devuan than probably anyone in the forum.  Ask me if I really use it to do any work on it!  Ask me why wouldn't I trust to do any work on it.

#23 Re: Devuan Derivatives » Vuu-do and Miyo why isn't Alt-f Alt-e not working? » 2018-01-26 20:31:43

More weirdness, the same stick I installed miyo32extra I had left at work upgrading to ascii
When I went to it today I noticed the alt-f wasn't a problem.
The original installation was done on the same machine that 32 wouldn't let alt-f work and 64 was ok.
Now is the different hw the difference or did the upgrade to ascii fix the problem?
The upgrade was taking so long I just let it run and left.
I also noticed that refracta-installer was on the list to be upgraded, check your version before next issue.

#24 Re: DIY » Tips for using Palemoon » 2018-01-26 20:24:17

Let's say you want some scripts in some pages, but not on the rest, this solution is inconvenient.  The no-script button you can click to ublock temporarily or permanently or permanently block a single site.  On a classic news/media article you will be surprised on how many sites are at it studying who you are and what you are interested in.

This here forum works fine with no scripts.  Not your usual situation this days.
On mx/anti-x not only you need scripts but you need them to go through clouds to get to it.

“The reasonable man adapts himself to the world: the unreasonable one persists in trying to adapt the world to himself. Therefore all progress depends on the unreasonable man.”

― George Bernard Shaw

#25 Re: Installation » pkgmaster is repository hell » 2018-01-26 19:59:16

Tom is Sam's brother

If you are on Jessie and you try it with ascii in all three tries you should get the same numbers, x to remove, y to upgrade, z to install.
where x1 = x2 = x3
y1 = y2 = y3
z1 = z2 = z3
http 1
https 2
tor 3

You can also split 3 into two tries
one will say tor:// the other tor://dev.....onion

Another way is to put the same repository in the same source list, just one ascii main for example, and give the three different addresses and see when they update if the amount of the release, (the size of the directory) is the same for all.  I flipped yesterday when I tried it and it was coming out as a different amount!  Then I knew I was right all along.

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