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#1 Re: Devuan Derivatives » oh! an exciting new derivatives based on debootstrap: EasyOS ! » 2025-08-21 23:11:44

I understand you objection but can't agree: as in the natur BOTH parents are parents, especially here where cousins like Refracta, Star, GNUinOS etc derivatives in exact the same type of size AND performance are considerate as really be in the familly of the parent distro. More, Puppy is not a distro but a methode of usage of stuff: the stuff itself is always coming from an other distro (initially slackware, later ubuntu, more later debian, and now devuan as Puppy also hates systemd!)...

#2 Re: Devuan Derivatives » oh! an exciting new derivatives based on debootstrap: EasyOS ! » 2025-08-20 21:26:08

error from me: my rest RAM was to small to download the complete iso. I am starting new now not in RAM as it is a big ISO!

#3 Re: Devuan Derivatives » oh! an exciting new derivatives based on debootstrap: EasyOS ! » 2025-08-20 21:09:14

i did download GNUinOS and it is finish now. That is a completely new iso with a big size of 3.4 gib and a name I can not understand actually: gnuinos-daedalus_2025.08.20_amd64_desktop.iso.download (downloaded so by falkon browser). What is to do with such a file?

(this is version daedalus! EasyOS is version excalibur!)

#6 Re: Devuan Derivatives » GNUinOS, search to begin with the beginning! » 2025-08-17 21:58:44

You think probably about why French people writes dédale (I don't forget the other threas ;-) !)?

#7 Re: Devuan Derivatives » what is the position of (the) GNU (community) concerning the 32 bits? » 2025-08-17 21:54:23

it is possible to write the same question (in consequence) differently and shorter:

why does the world hate more and more American people and not only Microsoft (owner of Youtube) and ebay as people try to show to their grand dad / grand ma the video about yoga for very old persons speaking only Tamil (I know that such a video exists really! I am myself 80 y. old and learn Tamil out solidarity for poor world regions, all poor world regions, else if I live myself in the good environment of a German city having lot of privileges).

The aggressiv restrictions coming from Silicon valley are not some real effort of freedom!

#8 Re: Devuan Derivatives » GNUinOS, search to begin with the beginning! » 2025-08-17 21:38:51

that is not the question: it is also present in GNUinOS (and the thread concerns GNUinOS) but as the packaging format is different and not compatible it is different (also for precedent versions of GNUinOS)!

#9 Devuan Derivatives » what is the position of (the) GNU (community) concerning the 32 bits? » 2025-08-17 21:35:49

32bits
Replies: 2

in complement to my question a. .. e. in that thread

https://dev1galaxy.org/viewtopic.php?id=7360

i have a last really thematic question:

f. what is the position of (the) GNU (community) concerning the 32 bits PC's.

I don't know how many good 32 bits PC's did be produce and how many of them did be retired but useful recycled (rare metals etc. ...) and how many of them did end in a shame...
I suppose perhaps billions...

But I am certain that

billions of persons, especially in undeveloped countries, and often both young and very old peoples, continue to have an urgent need to become integrated to the part of the humanity having access to news (weather, weather and weath prognostic are capital informations to produce and to do, illness, water, natural catastrophes, helping decisions and acts, politic, etc.), information (hygiene, propaged studies from UNO, WHO, etc, or conquetes of the humanity (univers, physic, chemie...), but also extinction of arts), and instruction (beginning with the school for little children to the ingineer high school following the modell of the Arts et Métiers in France, a school building ingineers saterday and sunday years allong, in the past ... without computer aid!).

And all the stuff being accessible actually has to be crashed because Intel, Microsoft, and also Linux (allo Linux, where are you?) find it is possible to be more "important" (and wine money) killing the actually present 32 bits branche?

And all the important manager of Intel, Microsoft, ... and also Linux (allo Linux, where are you) find it is possible to abandon those owners of old hard ware and stop to provide then with didactic stuff like videos from for ex. youtube compiled on a site of immens rich compagnies not having enough to win and win since 40 years and more from the product of people bringing without concrete paiement their stuff to the giant depository (I don't speak from the raptors like ebay and co., porno giants: they continue to be relatively accessible because also old men give money for a bit of prestations...). It is not the same like the disparition of Commodore 64 or ZX80 in the past: Those "PC"  were not or only a few adapted for real news, information or instruction target, only a few for communication (but it were not usual to have a portable phone at this time: today most people have that ... to phone, and a lot only to phone as they also are very old).

What find GNU about that?

#10 Devuan Derivatives » GNUinOS, search to begin with the beginning! » 2025-08-17 20:57:28

32bits
Replies: 5

Hi

In the last weeks, I did invest a lot of time to shrink my (refractasnapshot)isos with the most functions I need myself to work...
I did use 2 ways: refracta base / gnuinos base.
Refracta based small isos work / gnuinos based one don't work but are (a bit) smaller.

A bit seems for people installing full their Linux not important.

For those like I starting fresh with a live iso each time they boot the PC, it can be very attractive.

For this reason I would be very interesting to continue my (successful, using Refracta mini isos) experimentation with GNUinOS and to learn about the wonderfull but not comptatible packaging system on it.

The main problems with GNUinOS was always:
a. no mini-ISO to install online from CLI environment
b. no compatibility with other depositories, only the name of the level (Deadalus for. ex.)
c. unclear what consequences in case you have to complete the installation compiling a/the rest (not being to find at the GNUinOS depository)
d. (how to avoid stuff not beeing completely free and compatible with the GNU needs)
e. what is with testing and experimental branches?

Of course are a. and d. the most important open questions.

#11 Re: Devuan Derivatives » [PARTIALLY SOLVED] start difficulties with the 2 new Isos of GNUinOS » 2025-08-10 20:07:25

I only will be free. free from fest installation and it is possible with Linux. starting in RAM as you shot down the pc forget all. Barry Kauler (Puppy linux) did give us this possibility since 2003 ! I have an very old and venerable pc out this time with complete Linux with Firefox in only 10 Mb iso (made by an young German user of puppy linux having financed itself about 10 years along a great depository for Puppy linux). The size is definitiv a way to be free (as in the real live: look at Luxemburg, Monaco, etc. her "size"  is her power!)... Linux is a terribly over blowed system! And your version, I did unterstand, she propose goodies from GNU like  icecat, or emacs etc is overblowed because of those heavy stuff... As I do nothing more as write text (if possible with spell controll) a nano editor is good enough... Or no editor: didiwiki texts in the browers (used for localhost:8000 transaction: you get smart texts in ~/.didiwiki !). Why has a GNU system to be big? All in SliTaz seems to be equivalent with the exigences of GNU and completely free. But the iso' s with about complete distributions of SliTaz continue to be published with sizes UNDER 100 Mb in 32 and in 64 bits! See pls https://mirror.slitaz.org or https://slitaz.org ! SliTaz is an achronim saying : system linux totaly independant and all is free and all sources continue as far as I know to be present...

#12 Re: Devuan Derivatives » [PARTIALLY SOLVED] start difficulties with the 2 new Isos of GNUinOS » 2025-08-10 19:52:57

if you prepare 2 new isos, why not with 2 installers: the own gnuinos installer PLUS one other (a lot of distros comes in the last time with that equipment: a Debian... etc like in commando line and an other installer als icon in the live version.

#13 Re: Devuan Derivatives » [PARTIALLY SOLVED] start difficulties with the 2 new Isos of GNUinOS » 2025-08-10 19:48:12

Hi Aitor,
I did make 2 different experiences (not willing: it was the only way!) with gnuinos:

- install the AMD version with the gnuinos own installer as that did go, after that install the refracta tools to be independant later from terrible gnuinos own installer...

- try to install the 32 bits version completely legal with the gnuinos own installer and that did definitively not go on my PC (trying the same with the refractainstaller did permit to install. But I did loose a lot of time after that: nothing more than the initial scope of installation works correctly after that. And I am not exigent (for me, but only for me): I don't refuse lxdm or other (actually I use slim again toghether with the refracta installation but would prefer lightdm. I did avoid lightdm because of the amount of dependencies making that the ISO grows ...) but, if the auto login does not work, I have to login, the old console login is good enough for me! With a ln -s /usr/bin/startx /usr/bin/go I reduce the start job my login / my passwd / go and it is good: I don' t need some beautiful decorations to work! I don't need some diplay managere (DM) at all for myself!

amprolla infrastructure: I don't know what that is. I did search in French or German but did find nothing in the open community. Only a computer magazin in German offers a non free article about that. I can write a lot in English as English is only some kind of German dialect and I write and speak fluent German and can add French words hopping English speakers continue to understand all the scope of the French language. But I continue to have toil to understand long or special texts in English as it is not one of my languages...

you are from the Basque country. Perhaps you known some articles on amprolla in castillan or french?

#14 Re: Devuan Derivatives » Small installations with Refracta Linux » 2025-08-09 21:01:08

I did modify a bit the installation, the size of the snapshot for 64 bits is now 1,111,936Ki . It is a good size to boot into the RAM (I actually am "in the ram" and not at the Hard Disk)...

#15 Re: Devuan Derivatives » Small installations with Refracta Linux » 2025-08-09 20:52:47

in Troyes (I really am from ...) we did always say escalibur

wikipedia.fr: «La première mention de l'épée d'Arthur sous le nom d'« Excalibur » est due à Chrétien de Troyes.

L'étymologie de ce nom ancien, connu sous plusieurs variantes (Excalibor, Escalibor, Excaliber, Calibourne) n'est pas déterminée avec certitude, d'autant que « Excalibur » n'est pas le seul nom connu pour cette épée : par exemple, dans le conte Le Chevalier au papegau, elle s'appelle Chastiefol. Le mot « Excalibur » semble une altération savante d’éléments linguistiques issus du brittonique.»

I will here provocate because Devuan seems to like to play with names like dédale and escalibur having different writing in different languages. Why? Is Linux the most aggressiv defensor of the US American English now? Different from Microsoft, always respectfull for the other cultures...

(At installation's time, it is not possible to select "English" to install Debian or other like Debian with the real "locales" you need excepted you select a country where English is really the language... But you get a wrong time if you select "Irland" as European and all locales wrong if you select GB. Hm ...)

#16 Re: Devuan Derivatives » Small installations with Refracta Linux » 2025-08-08 20:26:54

Question: how to upgrade the Escalibur installation to Ceres?

#17 Devuan Derivatives » Small installations with Refracta Linux » 2025-08-08 20:24:59

32bits
Replies: 8

Small installations with Refracta Linux

I was not connected 2 long days along working to help my PC to be performant again. I did do it with Refracta Linux using the nox versions both in 32 and in 64 bits. And I am happy, all seems to work today evening. It seems to be parent with GNUinOS, perhaps is Refracta Linux the base of GNUinOS? I will make a new tread to report on that other experience, and repeat this message in the new thread to introduce the separate discussion.

The 2 installations seem to work very well but are not really so small as the installation with GNUinOS.  As my efforts have to reach very small installations, it is a bit a deception.

In both cases, I did use the small ISOs offered at the webpage of Refracta Linux.

- for 32 bit the nox version with Daedalus
- for 64 bit the nox version with Escalibur

My procedere were simple:

- start the ISO as download from USB memory card
- remove the stuff I don't want to use (mc, vim)
- install on the disk with refractainstaller
- restart from HD now
- install xorg menu jwm slim info wget
- update upgrade
- refractasnapshot
- restart from USB memory card this actualized base and a just graphic system
- reinstall on the HD with refractainstaller to look if all works
- add the rest, first part:

sudo apt install didiwiki drawing enchant-2 gimagereader gimp gnumeric gnumeric-plugins-extra gpm gocr gv hunspell links2 mgp mhwaveedit mousepad mplayer mplayer-gui nted pipewire ranger textdraw viewnior xfce4-appfinder xsane

I did add in ~/ a file .Xressources with following 2 lines

*.font: xft:monospace:style=Bold:size=13
XTerm.vt100.reverseVideo: true

So get xterm a view like an high performance console!

In /etc/jwm/system.jwmrc I did add an important line for screenshot in this block of lines:

<Program icon="utilities-terminal" label="apps">xfce4-appfinder</Program>
        <Program icon="utilities-terminal" label="console">console</Program>
        <Program icon="utilities-terminal" label="files">files</Program>
        <Program label="screenshot" confirm="false">xwd | xwud</Program>
        <Program icon="utilities-terminal" label="txt">txt</Program>
        <Program icon="utilities-terminal" label="web">web</Program>

actually, console is a link -> xterm, files -> ranger, txt -> mousepad, web -> links or luakit!

But deception:

The installation give me a /usr/share/applications/ranger.desktop file ready to use but ...
... it does not work! And I don't understand why.

I have to prepare myself more *.desktop files for xcalc xedit xditview .

My smart text processing app is the browser! I use didiwiki. It can do a lot (also in the very simple browser links2 !!! Including show very difficult writing like Indian Tamil, or Korean): normal - bold - italic - underlined - diverses titles - center - pictures - columns etc. The page are in text format and can be acceded in the hidden subdir ~/.didiwiki (a link helps to make then directly accessible!).

I have a print screen!

2 graphic text editors (xedit and mousepad) with hunspell

gnumeric

full support for scan and ocr (using gocr for common usage; tesseract-ocr can be added on demand)

idem for graphic usage and multimedia

and a good menu for graphic app's : xfce4-appfinder.

This extremely frugal version was a test if possible to fit all that in 1 GB: in 32bits yes but just. In 64 bits not any more. Of course, that equipment is very frugal.

In 64 bits I add over that luakit. I is extremely fast and good.

In 32 bits I don't know some smal and good browser any more.

#18 Re: Devuan Derivatives » [PARTIALLY SOLVED] start difficulties with the 2 new Isos of GNUinOS » 2025-08-08 19:35:04

Hi aitos and thank you for your interest for my problems. Excuse me please: I was not connected 2 long days along working to help my PC to be performant again. I did do it with Refracta Linux using the nox versions both in 32 and in 64 bits. And I am happy, all seems to work today evening. It seems to be parent with GNUinOS, perhaps is Refracta Linux the base of GNUinOS? I will make a new tread to report on that other experience, and repeat this message in the new thread to introduce the separate discussion.

#19 Devuan Derivatives » the firefox made icecat disease ... » 2025-08-02 09:08:44

32bits
Replies: 1

a very important reason to refuse firefox is that it needs separate dictionaries. as I use live systems, I refuse to install more than ONE SET of dictionaries for all text applications excepted OCR of course (because of the graphik part of the problem). More: It is so, that I complete my dictionaries myself and that downloaded ones are not good, can not be good enough.

seems to herit of that problem...

or is a way known to reinstall hunspell dictionaries used by all other applications having spell control as in the past (iceape would offer that ability but the Mozilla business men did kill the old Mozilla suite...)?

#20 Re: Devuan Derivatives » [PARTIALLY SOLVED] start difficulties with the 2 new Isos of GNUinOS » 2025-08-02 08:22:44

Note: the condition of my 32 bits ISO is unchanged as I can't install with the official GNUinOS installer. I suppose it is not a matter of the ugly LXDM but an other system problem concerning the connection of keyboard at booting time. I would need help to re intall with the official GNUinOS installer first and only later to continue with the fantastic Refractasnapshot!

#21 Re: Devuan Derivatives » [PARTIALLY SOLVED] start difficulties with the 2 new Isos of GNUinOS » 2025-08-02 08:17:50

finish (as far I will do it myself).

the new snapshot iso image of the small 64 system exists now and seems to work well (after login out / login in again) with all the stuff named in the precedent message except 2 that I did sacrify for a best iso size:

- mpv (replaced by mplayer-gui as I MUST have mplayer to look at phases of video such a yoga exercice of 2 .. 3 minutes in a video with a global time of 30 minutes: you can write the starting point in a simple text document and start the vew at mplayer in the console exactly at the wished second!)
- librecad (I don't use it daily at all!)

actual size of the 64 bit Refractasnapshot ISO : 1,047 Gb

as GNUinOS is the actual Debian linux stable, it is really very good. Thank you again very much developpers of GNUinOS and Refracta tools. I use it actually out the RAM and use of course Luakit as browser. Also thank you very much to the developpers of Lua, Luakit and Webkit!

Note: if you erase iceape as I do to spare ISO size, don't forget to erase your ~/.mozilla dir! It is perhaps a really big hidden subdir!

Loading time of the new ISO (1,047 Gb) on my PC: 1 minute and 3 seconds! Perfect. You can immediately plug the USB card out if the transfer to the ram is finish (you see it in the boot visualisation) and the USB is now free... The system out the RAM is super fast and discret. Tracking only in the actual session possible. At the next shutdown the RAM forget all what you did do!

#22 Re: Devuan Derivatives » [PARTIALLY SOLVED] start difficulties with the 2 new Isos of GNUinOS » 2025-08-02 06:42:54

today I did immediately try to help me myself purging the ugly lxdm after the installation of lightdm and this help really, hurrah!

new snapshot
new burning of the iso image on the memory card
2 new starts
- one start with the first option of the snapshot iso
- one start with the option "from RAM" (I am actually in that option! The snapshot did remember all: my login at the forum, the thread in the forum and probably more...)

in both cases enters lightdm in the display without some problem any more
in both cases no connection with the keyboard but the mouse works
in both cases it is possible to logout with the mouse

as the "snapshoted" session is not some session without login it was possible to logout properly and

in both cases it is possible to login a second time as usual

and

in both cases the keyboard works properly after that!

it is not ideal,

but

it now works!

I am happy!

#23 Re: Devuan Derivatives » [PARTIALLY SOLVED] start difficulties with the 2 new Isos of GNUinOS » 2025-08-01 23:54:00

as I can not go to bed with this poor result, I did reinstall once time more from the Original ISO for AMD 64 using the GNUinOS installer (in the AMD version, it works well and fast. But as usual now, grub does not search for other installations...).

after that, I did only
- change in /etc/sudoers
- sudo apt update
- sudo apt install refractasnapshot-base infractasnapshot-gui
- sudo copy /home/snapshot/*.iso /i.iso # this spares time to write the long names ...
- sudo dd if=/i.iso of=/dev/sdb status=progress
and restart with the written 1,2 Gb iso image from snapshot. Nothing more...

and?

select the normal option no. 1
the memory card starts to boot the iso
x try to appear
instead of x
comes now the terrible error message: "unable to load startlxde"

start lxde, of course ... it is the reason of the troubles: we don' t have to do with some lxde but with xfce4 !!!!

I suppose it is exactly the same problem in the i686 iso!

I find it would be better to upload new isos with lightdm or slim and a correct display start...

And it would be better to strip both images and don't to install viewer requiring a full own webkit version, the heavy editor emacs etc ...

As no office is preinstalled user can do that themself.

Note: in icecat are bookmarks present. But no one to devuan, refracta and that forum ;-)

#24 Re: Devuan Derivatives » [PARTIALLY SOLVED] start difficulties with the 2 new Isos of GNUinOS » 2025-08-01 22:27:32

probably are the problems in 32 bits from the same kind but have only not the same tragic consequence: it seems not to be a matter of rights but only from dysfunction of the input  equipment. I will try it again on my other laptops in the next days (to much time invested for today! I am now in the hurry...) having only an usual keyboard and touchpad...

#25 Re: Devuan Derivatives » [PARTIALLY SOLVED] start difficulties with the 2 new Isos of GNUinOS » 2025-08-01 22:20:15

I did try the same experience this evening with the 64 bit version for AMD.

different from the 32 bit version, with it the installation with the GNUinOS installer did work immediately (and the other way I did use in 32 bit starting from the iso live and installing after the installation from refractainstaller out the live started image would not start).

the result is about the same.

but the problems begin after that trying to start the new version as regular snapshot-ISO from the full installed version from Hard Disk (the normal correct way to do that!): it seems impossible to get keyboard or accede to x from usb card. GNUinISO seems to have a special start modus giving on my PC (it is "transformer" Dell Latitude PC with touch screen and keyboard and touch pad and joystick-pin in the middle of the keyboard between G and H) only disturb. As for the 32 bit Snapshot, the new size is 1 GB (probably 10 % more probably because of the full installation) but the snapshot is not usable (I did try to interchange the display manager from LXDM (why lxdm? it is in the last time unusual) to slim adding JWM to avoid the possible problem of xfce4 having to work with some part of lxde but it is not better: In ram only start of the snapshot iso image, x appears but no keyboard or touch screen reaction (the mouse works! it is possible to start app's!)...
sorry...

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