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#1 Re: Devuan » A philosophical diatribe: How to avoid having users - and how not to » 2019-02-21 22:44:45

I must admit ESR himself is a character I don't like much, but I also agree with cynwulf that his main point in the OP is valid: to beat systemd there has to be a really viable alternative to the "big" distros using it. There may also happen other scenarios, like a hypothetical growing frustration with systemd among devs and maintainer of some big distros or whatever, but those hypothetical scenarios assume a relatively passive stance, which might also finish up in ever more software being systemd-dependent, and so push out Devuan and similars out of the picture.

However, though, I tend to think it is still a bit too early to say whether Devuan is doing it right or not. Given the convenience of earliness, ESR thought it was a good time to say and/or do something about it, it didn't go too well here, but I don't really see it as a catastrophe of any kind. It's not by attracting ESR's that Devuan will grow and become a viable alternative to the big players using systemd, but by attracting end users.
Now, if I got it right, Devuan aspires to be a "metadistro", like Debian is. So, once Devuan matures enough, "all we need" will be some sort of Devuan-based "Ubuntu". The question is, will it ever and when will it happend? What to do in the meantime? How to keep it going while the systemd "virus" spreads?

#2 Re: DIY » Input requested regarding Suspend » 2019-02-16 17:24:55

I'm with imhigh.today and xinomilo, it should have at least the option to lock. I want my screen to be locked when resuming from either suspend or hibernate.

#3 Re: Desktop and Multimedia » Software update notifications in XFCE » 2019-02-16 17:19:36

MiyoLinux wrote:

I don't know...perhaps the mail only goes out once a day?

Regarding the location of the log...I'm on my phone, so I'm doing this from memory...

I don't remember the actual name of the cron log file...but it's located in /var/log/ and it has "cron" in the name.

EDITED: Of all things, it's called cron.log   LOLOLOL! tongue

If it's not already there, check to see if cron is commented out in the rsyslog.conf file...found in /etc/rsyslog.conf.

I think you may have to reboot after uncommenting cron in the rsyslog.conf file for it to show up in /var/log.

No, the mail is delivered every time a root cron job is done... But you ARE right in the end. Last night I was sleepy and I deleted the mail before I checked it, and then commented basing myself on loose observation. Today I was brighter, and I checked the mail and when the various messages were sent: 15:00 and 18:00 h, for now.... and my laptop was on since about 13:00, So it's obvious I was in error. :-D Sorry for raising confusion. XD But I learned something. :-)

#4 Re: Desktop and Multimedia » Software update notifications in XFCE » 2019-02-16 02:06:14

I've been reading this guide, that brought me to my undestanding: https://code.tutsplus.com/tutorials/sch … --net-8800

Where do you get that log? I've been just observing when do I get the aforementioned mail from the cron job...

My cron job for the update is set like this: 0 */3 * * * root /usr/bin/apt-get update

According to what you say and what seems from that log, it would mean it would be done at 3 am, 6 am etc... But I received that mail some time after midnight and before 3 am -- of that I'm sure. So I believe it counts 3 hours since the computer boot up, and than again, and again... I will give more precise attention to it tomorrow.

It IS confusing...

#5 Re: Devuan » A philosophical diatribe: How to avoid having users - and how not to » 2019-02-15 21:14:50

He did have some good points, and some less good ones. And some of the good ones did seemingly have an impact, however small or slow, according to the circumstances, I guess... And all this IN SPITE of his megalomaniac egotistic *ssholish first post. I don't care if he is THE ESR, or a fake one. In a social context, you very often get the treatment you give -- and I believe this is what happened here. The fact someone is ESR or Poettering, or even Torvalds or RMS, shouln't give them any immunity to that fact. ESR's first approach wasn't much friendlier than what he got back.

#6 Re: Desktop and Multimedia » Software update notifications in XFCE » 2019-02-15 20:34:40

Are you sure? If I understand that syntax right, that means every 3:45 h since a computer is started. I believe 3 would mean at 3 am, and */3 means every 3 hours since you start a computer... Am I wrong about it? At least, that's what it seems to work like here on my machine...

#7 Re: Desktop and Multimedia » Software update notifications in XFCE » 2019-02-15 13:31:10

MiyoLinux wrote:

I ended up using this for the cron job on my personal update notifier...

45 */7 * * * root /usr/bin/apt-get update

...and I have the update-notifier.py checking for updates every 8 hours.

I've been so busy that I forgot to upload a new .zip file for anyone else who may want to try it. The one that I uploaded is the one that I've included on the upcoming i3 versions. Its cron job is set up for this...

45 */3 * * * root /usr/bin/apt-get update

...and the update-notifier.py checks for updates every 4 hours.

If I am not mistaken, this is every 7 hours and 45 minutes, and every 3 hours and 45 minutes, respectively. Which is also fine.

Thank you for the updates :-)

#8 Re: Hardware & System Configuration » WiFi doesn't reconnect after laptop powers on » 2019-02-14 03:43:47

Yeah, I was about to say: "Check 'automatically connect' in Wicd... I don't know, but this works fine on my laptop, and I don't have any idea why would it not on yours. So I am really replying just for bumping your post... XD

If everything else fails, maybe you can try with Network Manager... Does it work in Devuan (i.e. no systemd)? I haven't tried it myself... Not yet, at least.

#9 Re: Desktop and Multimedia » Software update notifications in XFCE » 2019-02-14 03:32:43

Seems like I've actually screwed it up with my modifications... XD It was just showing up notification every so hours, no matter if there was or wasn't any updates. :-D I've tried to further tinker about the code, but to no avail. So I just went back to apt-get and the cron job and all as before. :-D

BTW, I think the correct syntax for the cron job to be run every 8 hours is: 0 */8 * * * root /usr/bin/apt-get update

#10 Re: News & Announcements » Jaromil presentation FOSDEM 2019 » 2019-02-12 22:41:18

Obviously... XD

I've known, somewhat, about Jaromil and Dyne.org for many years, but I didn't caught he was among the VUA and all... :-p Good to know. :-)

#11 Re: News & Announcements » Jaromil presentation FOSDEM 2019 » 2019-02-12 18:59:14

Is Jaromil a member of the Devuan team? I think I saw a tweet that might imply it, some time ago...

#12 Re: Desktop and Multimedia » Software update notifications in XFCE » 2019-02-12 18:48:14

@fsmithred and @Geoff 42:

Indeed, when I tried greping from "apt update" in terminal, apt did output a warning about it not having a stable interface, and that therefore scripting it is discouraged, but the grep output was exactly what I expected it to be, so I figured it is probably stable enough for what we need here, and I put it in the python script, anyway. And in fact, I AM getting update notifications, just as expected. It works! :-)

Now, some might still protest against using apt in scripts, but this way we have one configuration file less, which makes it simpler. And if simpler gives the same result, than simpler is better, IMO.

What do you think Miyo?

#13 Re: Off-topic » Did anyone else come from crunchbang? » 2019-02-11 22:09:33

I've been also using #! for some time, and I liked it a lot. I've been fascinated by its efficiency in combining minimalism and out-of-the-box every-day usability. One of the best distros ever, IMO.

#14 Re: Desktop and Multimedia » Software update notifications in XFCE » 2019-02-11 21:45:08

OK, I have tried to change only the check command in the script to this: check = "/usr/bin/apt update | /bin/grep -c 'upgraded'",

And I have removed the cron job, as redundant, if this works.

We'll see in time if it works now...

#15 Re: Desktop and Multimedia » Software update notifications in XFCE » 2019-02-11 21:22:23

@fsmithred and @MiyoLinux

So, if I understand it right, the script is actually relying on a cron job of "apt-get update" done every 30 minutes for having fresh package data... and THAT is where I am getting the mail from. But wouldn't it be a more elegant solution if the script itself would just do an "apt update", instead of apt-get, as the check command, and thus dismissing the cron job altogether? Unlike "apt-get update", "apt update" outputs if there are upgrades available after updating repos. I'm just not sure how to implement it in the script itself...

#16 Re: Desktop and Multimedia » Software update notifications in XFCE » 2019-02-08 00:37:25

I have noticed I am receiving "mail" with logs from this script in /var/mail/<myusername>. I am not sure if it is caused by the script or otherwise, but I would like it to stop. XD Any ideas?

#17 Re: Desktop and Multimedia » Software update notifications in XFCE » 2019-02-07 10:40:29

Thank you again! I have just adapted it more to my liking. :-)

#18 Re: Desktop and Multimedia » Software update notifications in XFCE » 2019-02-06 23:38:24

OK, thanks! Indeed, I would make it a bit less frequently... :-)

#19 Re: Desktop and Multimedia » Software update notifications in XFCE » 2019-02-06 22:46:51

All right, it seems to work as expected. :-) It notified me of upgrades a minute ago, and I am upgrading just now.

#20 Re: Desktop and Multimedia » Software update notifications in XFCE » 2019-02-06 22:32:50

OK, I've set it up. But there are no upgrades available ATM, so we have to wait to see how it works here... XD

#21 Re: Desktop and Multimedia » Software update notifications in XFCE » 2019-02-06 17:24:52

Thank you. I am a bit busy ATM, so I will try it out later. :-)

#22 Re: Devuan » Meet cinnabar (Beowulf default theme) » 2019-02-06 00:41:39

Kewl! :-) Will it hit repos any time soon?

#23 Re: Desktop and Multimedia » Software update notifications in XFCE » 2019-02-06 00:37:23

MiyoLinux wrote:

I wonder if the pk-update-icon problems could be related to it being broken in "testing" versions...possible, but I don't know.

The only other indicator that I'm aware of is...

package-update-indicator

...but I've never tried it.

They're one and the same. apt search says:

package-update-indicator/testing,unstable 2.0-1 amd64
  Notify about available software updates

pk-update-icon/testing,testing,unstable,unstable 1:2.0-1 all
  transitional dummy package for package-update-indicator
golinux wrote:

I understand we all have our way of doing things but does it have to be an "update notifier"?  If there is a really important update, it will be mentioned on DNG or here at the forum etc.   Otherwise, why not just remember to update every so often.  I personally use gkrellm's "Reminder" plugin with a musical sting via VLC for recurring tasks.

Personally, I have the habit to upgrade my system at least twice a week. But I installed Devuan also on a friend's laptop, because it's old, and all... He's no computer geek, and such a utility comes out quite handy and makes things easier.

Also, I don't want a solution that would just automatically install, I want the user to be aware of available upgrades and let him/her decide if and when to install them, at best convenience.

#24 Re: Desktop and Multimedia » Software update notifications in XFCE » 2019-02-05 17:44:27

golinux wrote:
franko wrote:

This doesn't seem to work for me, since I am using Beowulf, and gksu, which is a dependency, has been deprecated... :-/

I also beat my head against the disappearance of gksu.  I worked it out in this thread on the Xfce forum.   I'm not often in beowulf (VM) so will have to revisit this myself soon.

pkexec seems to work fine for me on Beowulf. Only Mousepad, for some reason, gives me an error if I try to open it with pkexec... But I'm good enough with nano when I need to edit a file as root.

Geoff 42 wrote:

Although I use LXQt much of the time, it does mean that I have found lxqt-sudo. A quick check suggests that you could install it without pulling in too much else. I have been using this in Beowulf as a replacement for gksu.

As stated above, I'm fine with pkexec for now... But that's off topic and beside the point. The point here is I can't use the update notifier suggested by MiyoLinux, because the deprecated gksu is a dependency, and I am no coder, so I don't know how to change sources and recompile the whole thing to work with pkexec or anything else.

MiyoLinux wrote:

You could see if...

pk-update-icon

...is in the repos (I can't check right now).

It's similar to the Point Linux notifier, but requires a lot more dependencies.

It is in the repos, alright. I've tried it, but it pulls in with it the same updating software used in Ubuntu, which at first I thought was cool, since I came here from Ubuntu, but then it didn't work on Devuan... XD Sofware and Updates spits up some errors and then it doesn't start, and Software Updater, which is related, start up, and without checking it says there are no updates available, and it shuts down as soon as you click "OK", so you can do nothing to re-check or anything.

So, yeah.... Any other idea? :-D

#25 Re: Other Issues » Pinning a single package » 2019-02-05 17:15:35

Yes, I've seen this warning on the Devuan download page. That's why I used code names for pinning, ie. "n=beowulf" and "n=ceres".

Given that little, but important correction (n= instead of a=) xinomilo's suggestion seems to do what I want. But I'll be really sure of it just when a Firefox upgrade kicks in.

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