Thanks.

One thing that users can always get into is improving documentation. This is also a great way into understanding whatever it is you are documenting!

I learned GNU/Linux mainly by being a dumb user for several decades and having to solve problems (which on other OS were just not solvable). I also had some very basic UNIX skills to transfer and bought a lot of Linux mags for a couple of years (most of which eventually ended up in a Buddhist monastery somewhere, but that is another story).

Security is mostly focused on servers, for the simple reason that they are more attractive; they tend to be relatively stable, up 24/7, and can offer rich pickings. Clients have such a diverse ecology of distros and configurations, and a tendency to upgrade/shop around, never mind shut down and restart every day, that automated exploits are next to useless. Targeted attacks on specific users (spy vs. spy, etc.) are pretty much restricted to a large subset of those server skills.

But there are some things you can do/avoid to make sure your system stays that way, and a link introducing these has already been provided.

That does not surprise me. Still, anybody who has a Life glider for an avatar and suffers anomie at the foibles of the human condition is all right by me.

systemd
Seriously, you tell me why the good Devuan devs have so much work on their plates leveraging the "option" not to use systemd-based tools?

Not all clients are laptops, you don't need to go to servers to expand its scope.
But then again, the ability to plug your personal toolset into whatever server you are administering must seem a nice idea to some. Most servers I ever met ran desktops, remote or otherwise, for their admins.

Nothing wrong with a compatible set of tools, but there is everything wrong with bundling user toolsets into system init space.

Not enough tinfoil perhaps, but more to the point, why come and troll a community created expressly to expunge it all from our lives? If you want to abandon the "do one thing but do it well" philosophy of *nix, then why not go the whole hog and abandon *nix?

Ah yes, you get a lot of that there. But you also get experienced sysadmins telling it like it really is.

tl:dr then (and I cannot vouch for the correctness of all accusations, or the completeness of the list):
1. the number of users with their whole life on a USB stick, multiple Linux laptops and no further portability requirement is basically the number of homed developers.
2. "optional" in systemd speak means "to be baked in before you can say 'Poettering'".
3. similarly, "disabled by default" means "to be enabled by default next time you blink".
4. it is odiously insecure, exposing more vulns than it fixes.
5. ssh login credentials are so secure that you cannot log in to access your login credentials.
6. mixing home directories into system init is barking insanity, even on a personal laptop.
7. the whole thing is a Microsoft/IBM/Lizard plot to commercialise FLOSS.

Without going into detail, I buy some of that but not all of it.
IMHO systemd does some good things but more bad things but, far worse than that, its developer community have utterly failed to earn my trust. I fully expect homed to expand its scope over time until it rolls Debian over and tickles its tummy yet again. I also fully expect somebody sane to fork/clone/copy the good bits and do one thing at a time but do it well.

Sorry, I see no connection between my quoted remark and your reply.

Looks like it's full steam ahead for homed "portable home directories", now merged in ready for the next release: https://www.theregister.co.uk/2020/02/0 … o_systemd/

I tried searching Debian's public discussion forums for a reaction but could find nothing. On the other hand, the El Reg commentards are unanimous in their (or rather our, I confess) blistering condemnation: https://forums.theregister.co.uk/forum/ … o_systemd/

Makes me wonder which way the wind is really blowing.

My shorter-term wishlist is a little more subtle. Every package that Devuan currently has to clean up should be refactored at source to be compatible with both Init and SystemD. This is more a case of upstream contribution/persuasion/evangelism that direct Devuan build, but once upstream developers get the habit it would bring new goodness directly into Devuan in the longer term. It would also help provide a clean, trouble-free install for Debian users who choose to avoid SystemD, a win-win all round.

Hoping to understand the relationship between Devuan and Debian versions in simple words. As I currently understand it:

1. Devuan community maintain SystemD-free versions of adulterated Debian packages, on Amprolla.
2. Amprolla automatically identifies and pulls in the other packages, from Debian repos, which have not been modified by Devuan community.
3. Current Devuan state is the merge of these two resources on Amprolla.

Is this correct?

Also, which Debian repos - Testing or Stable?

Does it all mean that Stretch, the new Debian Stable, is effectively the default base for Devuan, or is Amprolla still full of Debian Jessie packages and is waiting for somebody to trigger another trawl, through the Stretch repos?