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#1 2017-08-18 22:49:30

fungus
Member
From: Any witch way
Registered: 2017-07-12
Posts: 389
Website

apt apt-get synaptic madness in ceres (major BUG or what?)

Not even 24hr from last upgrade which seems to have fixed an unexplained breakage I've experienced for 10 days, I am now speechless about what the upgrade process in ceres means.  I used to be a faithfull runner of sid for years.

This is the output of attempting to upgrade and the discovery of how different the process of apt-get dist-upgrade and apt upgrade is:
It actually want for some reason to remove packages I have and use daily that still exist in the ceres repository and are current.  They are not owned by a group or other package, I intentionally installed "them" to use them.  Retext and Kate?  Must be removed to follow the upgrade sequence?  How many more packages would I have to hold back/lock so they are not magically removed.  And there are some who suggest and recommend automatic unattended updates?  Before you know it you will not recognize half the system in its given current state.
Qupzilla is locked because the "upgrade" is not installable.
Tor-launcher other than deleting all your settings and bookmarks has no reason to even exist or ever be upgraded as tor-browser auto-updates anyway, without the launcher.  Made the mistake once, never again.  Tor-launcher does not even include tor-browser but the gui that downloads and verifies the browser itself.
Now I will have to lock kate and retext.  Are all their dependencies safe if they are locked or will I just lose functionality?
If I get to the point to have so many packages locked, that do not even have an upgraded version, just that the ceres architecture doesn't want them installed anymore, even though they exist in the ceres repository, how do I get informed that an actual upgrade can be done?

Is this crazy, is it a mistake, what is it.  Ascii I have given up trying to see if it gets fixed, next week maybe I will try.  It is locked and I can't destroy my usb ports trying to unlock the keyboard and mouse.  No developer in 10 days has even offered a hint to diagnose the problem.  Is this forum a joke between dissoriented users?

How am I keeping gnupg back from being upgraded, because I want to keep qupzilla from being erased a second time?  I sure haven't locked all this that is been held back.


$ sudo apt-get dist-upgrade
Reading package lists... Done
Building dependency tree       
Reading state information... Done
Calculating upgrade... Done
The following packages were automatically installed and are no longer required:
  kactivities-bin kactivitymanagerd kate5-data kio kpackagetool5 ktexteditor-data ktexteditor-katepart
  libbasicusageenvironment1 libcddb2 libdbusmenu-qt5-2 libdirectfb-1.2-9 libdvbpsi10 libebml4v5
  libevent-2.0-5 libfam0 libgit2-24 libgpgme11 libgpgmepp6 libgroupsock8 libhttp-parser2.1 libiso9660-8
  libkate1 libkf5activities5 libkf5archive5 libkf5attica5 libkf5auth-data libkf5auth5 libkf5bookmarks-data
  libkf5bookmarks5 libkf5calendarevents5 libkf5codecs-data libkf5codecs5 libkf5completion-data
  libkf5completion5 libkf5config-bin libkf5config-data libkf5configcore5 libkf5configgui5
  libkf5configwidgets-data libkf5configwidgets5 libkf5coreaddons-data libkf5coreaddons5 libkf5crash5
  libkf5dbusaddons-bin libkf5dbusaddons-data libkf5dbusaddons5 libkf5declarative-data libkf5globalaccel-bin
  libkf5globalaccel-data libkf5globalaccel5 libkf5globalaccelprivate5 libkf5guiaddons5 libkf5i18n-data
  libkf5i18n5 libkf5iconthemes-bin libkf5iconthemes-data libkf5iconthemes5 libkf5itemmodels5
  libkf5itemviews-data libkf5itemviews5 libkf5jobwidgets-data libkf5jobwidgets5 libkf5kiocore5
  libkf5kiofilewidgets5 libkf5kiontlm5 libkf5kiowidgets5 libkf5newstuff-data libkf5newstuff5
  libkf5notifications-data libkf5notifications5 libkf5package-data libkf5package5 libkf5parts-data
  libkf5parts-plugins libkf5parts5 libkf5plasma5 libkf5service-bin libkf5service-data libkf5service5
  libkf5solid5 libkf5solid5-data libkf5sonnet5-data libkf5sonnetcore5 libkf5sonnetui5 libkf5texteditor5
  libkf5textwidgets-data libkf5textwidgets5 libkf5threadweaver5 libkf5wallet-bin libkf5wallet-data
  libkf5wallet5 libkf5widgetsaddons-data libkf5widgetsaddons5 libkf5windowsystem-data libkf5windowsystem5
  libkf5xmlgui-bin libkf5xmlgui-data libkf5xmlgui5 libkwalletbackend5-5 liblivemedia58 libmatroska6v5
  libmpcdec6 libopenmpt-modplug1 libpcre16-3 libphonon4qt5-4 libpolkit-qt5-1-1 libproxy-tools
  libpulse-mainloop-glib0 libresid-builder0c2a libsidplay2 libupnp6 libusageenvironment3 libvcdinfo0
  libvlc-bin libvlc5 libvlccore8 libx265-116 libxcb-composite0 libxcb-damage0 libxcb-xv0
  linux-compiler-gcc-6-x86 linux-image-4.11.0-2-amd64 linux-kbuild-4.12 musescore-soundfont-gm phonon4qt5
  phonon4qt5-backend-vlc python3-sip qml-module-qtgraphicaleffects qml-module-qtquick-controls
  qml-module-qtquick-layouts qml-module-qtquick-window2 qml-module-qtquick2 sonnet-plugins vlc-data
  vlc-plugin-base vlc-plugin-video-output
Use 'sudo apt autoremove' to remove them.
The following packages will be REMOVED:
  kate kpackagelauncherqml libkf5declarative5 libkf5plasmaquick5 libkf5quickaddons5 plasma-framework
  python3-pyqt5 python3-pyqt5.qtwebkit qml-module-org-kde-kquickcontrols
  qml-module-org-kde-kquickcontrolsaddons retext
The following NEW packages will be installed:
  libqt5positioning5 libqt5webenginecore5 libqt5webenginewidgets5 libre2-3
The following packages have been kept back:
  dirmngr
The following packages will be upgraded:
  libqt5core5a libqt5dbus5 libqt5designer5 libqt5gui5 libqt5help5 libqt5network5 libqt5opengl5
  libqt5printsupport5 libqt5qml5 libqt5quick5 libqt5quickwidgets5 libqt5script5 libqt5sql5 libqt5sql5-sqlite
  libqt5svg5 libqt5test5 libqt5webchannel5 libqt5webkit5 libqt5widgets5 libqt5x11extras5 libqt5xml5
  libqupzilla1 qml-module-qtgraphicaleffects qml-module-qtquick-controls qml-module-qtquick-layouts
  qml-module-qtquick-window2 qml-module-qtquick2 qt5-gtk-platformtheme qupzilla
29 upgraded, 4 newly installed, 11 to remove and 1 not upgraded.
Need to get 56.4 MB of archives.
After this operation, 67.4 MB of additional disk space will be used.
Do you want to continue? [Y/n] n
Abort.
$ sudo apt-get upgrade
Reading package lists... Done
Building dependency tree       
Reading state information... Done
Calculating upgrade... Done
The following packages were automatically installed and are no longer required:
  libdirectfb-1.2-9 libevent-2.0-5 libx265-116 linux-compiler-gcc-6-x86 linux-image-4.11.0-2-amd64
  linux-kbuild-4.12 musescore-soundfont-gm
Use 'sudo apt autoremove' to remove them.
The following packages have been kept back:
  dirmngr gnupg libqt5core5a libqt5dbus5 libqt5designer5 libqt5gui5 libqt5help5 libqt5network5 libqt5opengl5
  libqt5printsupport5 libqt5qml5 libqt5quick5 libqt5quickwidgets5 libqt5script5 libqt5sql5 libqt5sql5-sqlite
  libqt5svg5 libqt5test5 libqt5webchannel5 libqt5webkit5 libqt5widgets5 libqt5x11extras5 libqt5xml5
  libqupzilla1 qml-module-qtgraphicaleffects qml-module-qtquick-controls qml-module-qtquick-layouts
  qml-module-qtquick-window2 qml-module-qtquick2 qt5-gtk-platformtheme qupzilla
0 upgraded, 0 newly installed, 0 to remove and 31 not upgraded.

$ apt upgrade is identical to apt-get upgrade
Dist-upgrade is by far different.  Never seen this before!

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#2 2017-08-18 23:01:38

golinux
Administrator
Registered: 2016-11-25
Posts: 684

Re: apt apt-get synaptic madness in ceres (major BUG or what?)

fungus wrote:

No developer in 10 days has even offered a hint to diagnose the problem.  Is this forum a joke between disoriented users?

This is a user forum but I hardly think it's joke.   Some devs rarely come here.   They do look at bug reports - I can't remember whether you filed one - and they hang out on irc channels.  What makes it worse is that many of them in EU are on a month long 'holiday' so things have pretty much ground to a halt.

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#3 2017-08-18 23:08:11

fungus
Member
From: Any witch way
Registered: 2017-07-12
Posts: 389
Website

Re: apt apt-get synaptic madness in ceres (major BUG or what?)

So who comes up with 3 massive upgrades a day in ceres?
I am not being sarcastic, but have the non-vacationing americans taken over?  ;D

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#4 2017-08-18 23:28:15

golinux
Administrator
Registered: 2016-11-25
Posts: 684

Re: apt apt-get synaptic madness in ceres (major BUG or what?)

fungus wrote:

So who comes up with 3 massive upgrades a day in ceres?

Probably coming from Debian.  I don't think that any of the devs are messing with ceres.

I am not being sarcastic, but have the non-vacationing americans taken over?  ;D

No.  Things are pretty much dead in the water atm.  Except for a few of us irrepressible folks from across the pond on help desk.

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#5 2017-08-19 00:31:43

fungus
Member
From: Any witch way
Registered: 2017-07-12
Posts: 389
Website

Re: apt apt-get synaptic madness in ceres (major BUG or what?)

Not that it really matters which side of the little pond we are all on, I've spent hald my life on one side and half on the other, but are you saying that pkgs from debian automatically and without attendance they spread on the devuan-rep's?  I find this both hard to believe and extremely problematic if it happens without auditing from a systemd stronghold.
I much rather not see a single upgrade in a month than to be fed systemd depended pkgs on my system because I follow the upgrade routine.
No wonder then my new miyo upgrade to ceres went crazy and it would say broken pkgs in pretty much anything I needed to install.
I may have out of curiocity looked to compare through the debian repositories in the past but have not downloaded anything from there.  Except for a kernel that I replaced again when 4.12 made it into Devuan.
In no way would I expect anyone on vacation to be dealing with our problems here.
Just a little frustrated in the past week or so without any guidance on how to go about a problem.
USB ports have a lifetime limit in pulled and plugged in again.  At least it is only ascii that is broken now.

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#6 2017-08-19 00:45:29

golinux
Administrator
Registered: 2016-11-25
Posts: 684

Re: apt apt-get synaptic madness in ceres (major BUG or what?)

AFAIK, no one is working on ceres atm. We've barely started on ascii.  Anyone running on ceres should have the chops to fix it.  But devuan has very unique problems that straight debian would not have.   amprolla has some systemd filters in place and that will improve in amprolla3 which is not operational yet.  Bottom line . . . if you want to live on the cutting edge, you just could get sushied!  Your choice.  It would progress devuan more if you were finding and helping with bugs in ascii.

*edit*  Have been re-thinking the above and I don't think it's quite right.  I don't know that the devs will ever take on anything in sid. Perhaps someone could clarify.

Another factor that might be affecting you ceres is that as yet there is no equivalent of debian's current testing  - buster.  So you've missed an entire release in your upgrade.

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#7 2017-08-19 08:51:54

fungus
Member
From: Any witch way
Registered: 2017-07-12
Posts: 389
Website

Re: apt apt-get synaptic madness in ceres (major BUG or what?)

I had no idea that the testing and unstable of devuan was not screened by Devuan.  I could also not have imagined that buster was skipped all together and unstable is sid, while ascii is stretch.  So this makes it a further miracle that ceres is running trouble free since yesterday while ascii is still broken.  I do have old installations of buster and sid and neither have ever resembled the problem in the login screen freezing my 2 input devices.  Out of curiosity last night visited and kate and retext were destined to be removed there as well.
So it is beginning to make some sense now that you threw some light into the mystery.

Also no wonder the mixmatch of miyo installation fell apart when brought up to ceres.  I wonder what miyo maestro will find in his late endeavor.

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#8 2017-08-19 14:17:02

golinux
Administrator
Registered: 2016-11-25
Posts: 684

Re: apt apt-get synaptic madness in ceres (major BUG or what?)

Just for clarity:

Devuan  =  Debian
Jessie 1.0  =  Jessie  (old stable)
ASCII (in process) = Stretch (stable)
Beowulf (not yet set up) = Buster (testing)
Ceres = sid

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