The officially official Devuan Forum!

You are not logged in.

#26 2024-06-02 23:35:37

nahkhiirmees
Member
Registered: 2022-07-24
Posts: 238  

Re: Fujitsu U728+lightdm+xfce , results in "gray screen" after logging out

Looks like this weekend i'm not going to do anything about that "postgres and *sqlalchemy*"-situation.
So maybe i'll try to a) remove all xfce-related packages and replace thwm with lxde-related packages b) replace elogind if possible.
Recently noticed this: https://dev1galaxy.org/viewtopic.php?id=5909 .

Although better to make some backups before a) and b) .

Offline

#27 2024-06-05 11:16:41

nahkhiirmees
Member
Registered: 2022-07-24
Posts: 238  

Re: Fujitsu U728+lightdm+xfce , results in "gray screen" after logging out

First attempt with a) and b) . Managed to get rid of xfce-related packages and libraries. And elogind also.
But then i tried to install lxde. Got stuck with complaints about libpango-something packages from apt. Couldn't install those packages back.
Looks like i was too trigger-happy when removing the libraries.

Time to find out if i can restore "/" from backup.

Btw. it is still possible to run xorg without display manager, right? In the Good Old Times it was possible, i think.

Offline

#28 2024-06-05 11:18:27

nahkhiirmees
Member
Registered: 2022-07-24
Posts: 238  

Re: Fujitsu U728+lightdm+xfce , results in "gray screen" after logging out

Sometimes i wonder if the problem is the machine i have or is it just too many bugs or features in the software ?

Maybe I just don't understand the software of today, so i'll have to throw sh*t around to see what sticks.

Note to self: https://wiki.gentoo.org/wiki/Elogind#st … ntegration and those udev-tricks meantioned earlier, try if those work or not.

And "/etc/environment"  -thing may be related to: https://www.reddit.com/r/Gentoo/comment … d_elogind/ .

Last edited by nahkhiirmees (2024-06-05 12:25:31)

Offline

#29 2024-06-05 20:30:56

nahkhiirmees
Member
Registered: 2022-07-24
Posts: 238  

Re: Fujitsu U728+lightdm+xfce , results in "gray screen" after logging out

Returned "/"-partition from backups succesfully.

Tried to install libpango-packaged before lxdm. GOt this complaint:

 apt-get install libpangoxft-1.0-0 libpangomm-1.4.1
Reading package lists... Done
Building dependency tree... Done
Reading state information... Done
Note, selecting 'libpangomm-1.4-1v5' for regex 'libpangomm-1.4.1'
Note, selecting 'libpangomm-1.4-1' for regex 'libpangomm-1.4.1'
libpangomm-1.4-1v5 is already the newest version (2.46.3-1).
libpangomm-1.4-1v5 set to manually installed.
Some packages could not be installed. This may mean that you have
requested an impossible situation or if you are using the unstable
distribution that some required packages have not yet been created
or been moved out of Incoming.
The following information may help to resolve the situation:

The following packages have unmet dependencies:
 libpangoxft-1.0-0 : Depends: libpango-1.0-0 (= 1.46.2-3) but 1.50.12+ds-1 is to be installed
                     Depends: libpangoft2-1.0-0 (= 1.46.2-3) but 1.50.12+ds-1 is to be installed
E: Unable to correct problems, you have held broken packages.

Trying to install lxde or lxde-core results in same complaint. With additional comlaints about lxsession.

So no lxde today.

Offline

#30 2024-06-05 20:55:51

nahkhiirmees
Member
Registered: 2022-07-24
Posts: 238  

Re: Fujitsu U728+lightdm+xfce , results in "gray screen" after logging out

TRied https://wiki.gentoo.org/wiki/Elogind#st … ntegration . Created .xinitrc with exec dbus-launch --exit-with-session lxdm .
After that, first attempts with startx in init 2 , sa normal_user resulred in something like that:

culd not connect to socket /run/seatd.sock
backend 'seatd' failed to open seat, skipping
logind.c:317 could not activate session: permission denied
seatd/server.c:145 new client connected (pid:xxxx uid:1000 gid:1000)
common/terminal.c:162 could not open target tty:permission denied
seatd/seat.c:72 could not open terminal for VT 0:permission denied
seatd/seat.c:461 could not open VT for client

Also added normal_user to group input. Didn't help, propably because now it is /dev/tty* - files that have wrong owners and rights. I'll try again with seatd installed.
Edit:Didn't help with startx i mean.

Last edited by nahkhiirmees (2024-06-05 22:07:00)

Offline

#31 2024-06-05 21:29:34

nahkhiirmees
Member
Registered: 2022-07-24
Posts: 238  

Re: Fujitsu U728+lightdm+xfce , results in "gray screen" after logging out

About https://wiki.gentoo.org/wiki/Elogind#st … ntegration  : if i say "--exit-with.session lxdm" in .xinitrc , startx exits with complains.
If i instead say, for example: "--exit-with-session /usr/lib/lxdm/lxdm-session" , my machine freezes with dark gray screen
.
And if i remove normal_user from group "input", my machine freezes again when in init 3 and trying to exit xfce.
So maybe it is time to try that "udev_trick".

Offline

#32 2024-06-05 21:47:45

nahkhiirmees
Member
Registered: 2022-07-24
Posts: 238  

Re: Fujitsu U728+lightdm+xfce , results in "gray screen" after logging out

Looks like adding LIBSEAT_BACKEND=logind to /etc/environment doesn't help, BTW.

Last edited by nahkhiirmees (2024-06-05 22:06:02)

Offline

#33 2024-06-05 22:21:51

nahkhiirmees
Member
Registered: 2022-07-24
Posts: 238  

Re: Fujitsu U728+lightdm+xfce , results in "gray screen" after logging out

Regarding to: https://www.reddit.com/r/linuxquestions … up_secure/
t hink that line

SUBSYSTEM=="usb", ATTR{idVendor}=="12ab", ATTR{idProduct}=="34dc", TAG+="uaccess"

is essential.

So i should make copies of that line for my keyboard and mousepad, right? Of course change vendor and product also...

cat /proc/bus/input/devices says among other things:

I: Bus=0011 Vendor=0001 Product=0001 Version=ab83
N: Name="AT Translated Set 2 keyboard"
P: Phys=isa0060/serio0/input0
S: Sysfs=/devices/platform/i8042/serio0/input/input0
U: Uniq=
H: Handlers=sysrq kbd leds event0 
B: PROP=0
B: EV=120013
B: KEY=402000000 3803078f800d001 feffffdfffefffff fffffffffffffffe
B: MSC=10
B: LED=7

I: Bus=0011 Vendor=0002 Product=000e Version=0000
N: Name="ETPS/2 Elantech Touchpad"
P: Phys=isa0060/serio2/input0
S: Sysfs=/devices/platform/i8042/serio2/input/input9
U: Uniq=
H: Handlers=mouse2 event3 
B: PROP=1
B: EV=b
B: KEY=e420 30000 0 0 0 0
B: ABS=661800011000003

should those devices be enough?

Offline

#34 2024-06-05 22:41:49

nahkhiirmees
Member
Registered: 2022-07-24
Posts: 238  

Re: Fujitsu U728+lightdm+xfce , results in "gray screen" after logging out

First attempt with a new file under /etc/udev/rules.d : failed.
Not a surprise actually, since i haven't done anything with udev rules before.

Edit. of course i'm aware of the fact that there's no more static files under /dev anymore. About 20 years ago there was 1 attempt to create the device files on demand? or during boot?
And then the second attempt which was called udev.

Last edited by nahkhiirmees (2024-06-05 22:51:38)

Offline

#35 2024-06-05 22:47:49

nahkhiirmees
Member
Registered: 2022-07-24
Posts: 238  

Re: Fujitsu U728+lightdm+xfce , results in "gray screen" after logging out

https://github.com/systemd/systemd/issues/4288 that issue was added almost 8 years ago, and https://www.reddit.com/r/linuxquestions … up_secure/ was 5 years ago. So i'll need to find something more recent.

Or use the Easy Way Out: usermod -aG input normal_user .

EDit. https://duckduckgo.com/?t=ftsa&q=how+to … les&ia=web

Last edited by nahkhiirmees (2024-06-05 23:08:13)

Offline

#36 2024-06-05 23:15:00

nahkhiirmees
Member
Registered: 2022-07-24
Posts: 238  

Re: Fujitsu U728+lightdm+xfce , results in "gray screen" after logging out

From another topic:

4b) the seatd method for mediating input devices requires acces to the seatd communications socket.

.
Tried "ls -las /run". Got

0 srwxr-xr-x  1 root       root          0 Jun  6 04:33 seatd.sock

amongst other things.
So now only root can write to seatd's socket.

Offline

#37 2024-06-06 17:21:40

nahkhiirmees
Member
Registered: 2022-07-24
Posts: 238  

Re: Fujitsu U728+lightdm+xfce , results in "gray screen" after logging out

If i'm going with the "udev-route" i have to figure out a) what to put into "action"-field so that external scripts execute when i log in or out b) what files under /dev/input should be changed .

On the other hand i think i know how to install Chimaera.

Offline

#38 2024-06-06 17:28:56

nahkhiirmees
Member
Registered: 2022-07-24
Posts: 238  

Re: Fujitsu U728+lightdm+xfce , results in "gray screen" after logging out

So,  xorg of today won't work alone? It needs elogind/seatd/some_kind_of_display_manager?
Or could it be that there's just wrong combination of packages installed? Lxdm+xfce is not a certified combination?

Though there's still the ssh-side-entry-trick i haven't tried yet.

Last edited by nahkhiirmees (2024-06-06 17:29:47)

Offline

#39 2024-06-06 20:16:56

nahkhiirmees
Member
Registered: 2022-07-24
Posts: 238  

Re: Fujitsu U728+lightdm+xfce , results in "gray screen" after logging out

Before trying ssh-tricks, i started Chimaera desktop live in vm. Noticed 1 difference from Daedalus i installed:
in daedalus, when logged into xfce, ls -las /dev/tty* says that root:tty are owners of all tty-files. And only /dev/tty has non-existent o-rights (crw-rw-rw-).
In Chimaera live, there are some tty-files with devuan:tty as owners, those files have non-existent u- and g- rights (crw------- devuan tty).

On the other hand, when i booted Chimaera i installed in a vm, the ls -las /dev/tty* looks exactly same as outside of the vm. So it is not that simple.

Earlier in another topic, when i said something about owners of tty-files(https://dev1galaxy.org/viewtopic.php?pid=49368#p49368) , i must have been in init 2 mode. In init 3 all the owners of tty-files are root:tty .

So, there are some kind of software bugs introduced after Chimaera or there's something wrong with my hardware.
In a way i hope for the latter. I get a chance to buy another ancient desktop to decay smile
NOt convinced about these laptops.

Last edited by nahkhiirmees (2024-06-06 20:39:41)

Offline

#40 2024-06-06 20:35:01

nahkhiirmees
Member
Registered: 2022-07-24
Posts: 238  

Re: Fujitsu U728+lightdm+xfce , results in "gray screen" after logging out

It may be that some bugs were introduced into elogind after version 246,10-2 . Or into login after 1:4.8.1-1.
Or xserver-xorg 1:7.7+22 .
Or some other package. There are many of them.

Last edited by nahkhiirmees (2024-06-06 20:38:43)

Offline

#41 2024-06-08 18:24:58

nahkhiirmees
Member
Registered: 2022-07-24
Posts: 238  

Re: Fujitsu U728+lightdm+xfce , results in "gray screen" after logging out

Now i know that i should have done incremental backups instead of full.
Trying to remove xfce-  and elogind- related packages had some side effects.
If i have to reinstall, i think i will use Chimaera dvd instead.

Last year i tried Chimaera minimal livedvd. Managed to install lxde without problems. At least i like to think that display manager and startx worked as expected.

But it was the "new" desktop then. With Fujitsu, all bets are off.

Last edited by nahkhiirmees (2024-06-08 18:26:00)

Offline

#42 2024-06-12 22:56:14

nahkhiirmees
Member
Registered: 2022-07-24
Posts: 238  

Re: Fujitsu U728+lightdm+xfce , results in "gray screen" after logging out

Tried to install libpango-packaged before lxdm. GOt this complaint:

Looks like i have mis-configured apt's sources somewhere in time. There's chimaera where there should be daedalus. Fixed that.

Also started experimenting with virtual machines. Trying to find out where things go wrong.
Installed Daedalus desktop. NOthing special with partitioning. Mostly went with defaults. Except that initrd should contain only the necessary modules. (accidentally /boot is a bit small so...)
And in "tasksel-phase" i chose only "console productve tools" and "lxde".

Edit.
/dev/input/* owned by root:input , crw-rw----
/dev/tty* owned by root:tty , most files have rights crw--w--- except /dev/tty
no seat
elogind is 264.10-5

Looks like i can log in and out to/from lxde without problems. Haven't remove any unnecessary packages yet. Or configured anything except apt.
Next snapshot is about removing the unnecessary.

Last edited by nahkhiirmees (2024-06-12 23:48:27)

Offline

#43 2024-06-12 23:14:40

nahkhiirmees
Member
Registered: 2022-07-24
Posts: 238  

Re: Fujitsu U728+lightdm+xfce , results in "gray screen" after logging out

Removing "libcupsfilters* ilbgphoto* avahi* blu* coinor* colord* cups* exim* ftp* gcr*"+"apt autoremove" after that and logging in and out still works.
Let's remove some more.

Next "apt-get remove --purge brltty* openssh* network-manager-* mobile* modem* && apt autoremove ".  Make "netstat - tulpan"'s list empty.
Still login&lgout works.

apt-get remove --purge ghostscript* gimp-data gir* gstreamer* gnome* gnupg* gvfs* && apt autoremove
and still log{in,out} are ok

"gnome* gnupg* gvfs* inetutils-telnet iw libreoffice*" purged+autoremove
still login/out ok

mailcap,mutt,ppp can be purged
purging pol* seems to want to remove lxde-related packages, should be more precise with pol-stuff, policykit-1* is tied to lxde-packages
maybe poppler have to be there too

vim* , wireless* wpa* can be removed
and lgin/out still ok

at least lxpolkit seems to need policykit-packages, lets see how Daedalus works withoyt that. I guess that was ok, but removing anything more lxde-related seems to be too much.

... And outside of vm there are no policykit/polkit/pkexec-packages installed. Maybe i found the source of problem- maybe not. Are there any desktop software in Devuan which doesn't need policykit or polkit?

Last edited by nahkhiirmees (2024-06-13 00:43:35)

Offline

#44 2024-06-13 01:30:32

nahkhiirmees
Member
Registered: 2022-07-24
Posts: 238  

Re: Fujitsu U728+lightdm+xfce , results in "gray screen" after logging out

Found this: https://forums.gentoo.org/viewtopic-t-1 … ssion.html .
And then there were also: https://unix.stackexchange.com/question … tion-agent .
Though different distributions and some other differences.

Last edited by nahkhiirmees (2024-06-13 01:46:04)

Offline

#45 2024-06-13 01:47:40

nahkhiirmees
Member
Registered: 2022-07-24
Posts: 238  

Re: Fujitsu U728+lightdm+xfce , results in "gray screen" after logging out

Another experiment.
Installed Daedalus netinstall into vm.
After that told apt to install twm and xinit.
Tried startx with root and normal_user. In both cases startx exited immediately, no freezing.

As normal_user command

 grep EE ~/.local/share/xorg/Xorg.0.log 

returned rows like:

(EE) seatd_libseat device not open (/dev/input/eventX) 

and that normal_user doesn't belong to group input.
And same "EE rows" can be found in /var/log/Xorg.0.log after running startx as root.

EDit. after "apt-get install lxde" , running startx as normal_user started lxde session which i could exit without problems.
Let's find out again what happens after removing unnecessary packages.

Edit.2.
purging packages from libcupsfilters* to gstreamer* + autoremove and lightdm still works as expected
and same for going te previous list to vim and others.
Next try to remove pol-packages... "login box" works. Also i can use twm's menu because i installed that.

Last edited by nahkhiirmees (2024-06-13 02:41:51)

Offline

#46 2024-06-13 12:31:39

nahkhiirmees
Member
Registered: 2022-07-24
Posts: 238  

Re: Fujitsu U728+lightdm+xfce , results in "gray screen" after logging out

Returned to earlier snapshot of "netinstall". To a situation, where xinit and twm were installed but not yet lxde.
Startx didn't work. Made xinit work by installing xterm.
Before installing xterm," grep EE ~/.local/share/xorg/Xorg.log" returned rows like "seatd_libseat device not open".

Offline

#47 2024-06-13 12:39:35

nahkhiirmees
Member
Registered: 2022-07-24
Posts: 238  

Re: Fujitsu U728+lightdm+xfce , results in "gray screen" after logging out

So, xorg of Daedalus, it needs something that is not available when there is no proper display manager installed, am i right?
What it is that i need to make startx working?

Btw.

ps -aux | grep seat

returned

root SOME_THINGS /usr/sbin/seatd -g video

. So now there's seatd running, as root.
But if it is running as root, it shouldn't have had problems with access rights of /dev/input/* .

Edit.

And when started xinit as normal_user "ps -aux | grep X" returned

$normal_user $some_things tty1 /usr/lib/xorg/Xorg:0

.
So X is running as normal_user when i start it from text_mode . Running as $normal_user would explain the problems with /dev/input/* - files .

It has been a while since i had to write .xinitrc . So, after "#!/bin/sh" , i start window_manager with & at the end of the command, and after that some other commands, right?

Not happy about adding normal_user to group input...

Last edited by nahkhiirmees (2024-06-13 12:52:19)

Offline

#48 2024-06-13 13:30:43

nahkhiirmees
Member
Registered: 2022-07-24
Posts: 238  

Re: Fujitsu U728+lightdm+xfce , results in "gray screen" after logging out

It may be possible to have a working GUI with Daedalus.
Just have to remember to say, while in text mode: "apt get install twm xterm xinit openbox" . And maybe seatd.
Hope i won't miss xfce too much.

Last edited by nahkhiirmees (2024-06-13 13:31:03)

Offline

#49 2024-06-13 13:38:45

nahkhiirmees
Member
Registered: 2022-07-24
Posts: 238  

Re: Fujitsu U728+lightdm+xfce , results in "gray screen" after logging out

Now there seem to be a new problem:if i want to keep polkit- and libpolkit - packages out of my system, i can't have wireplumber.
So i may have to learn how to make Fujitsu's audio work for real, without helper packages.

Btw. any ideas about a desktop environment without need for polkit or policykit?

Last edited by nahkhiirmees (2024-06-13 13:39:53)

Offline

#50 2024-06-14 09:48:51

nahkhiirmees
Member
Registered: 2022-07-24
Posts: 238  

Re: Fujitsu U728+lightdm+xfce , results in "gray screen" after logging out

Answering to myself: commands "dpkg -l pol*", "dpkg -l libpol*" and "apt-cache showpkg" could possibly help with finding a proper desktop environment.

In xfce there is thunar which has troubling dependencies. Also i found out that it is libreoffice that needs libcups-something.
Last year i was wondering why libcups was needed, now i got my answer finally smile

And of course lxde-something-packages need policykit.

Next time when trying to reinstall, maybe i'll try Deaedalus netinstall with openbox+lxdm.
And then there's always Chimaera. Or how long it is still supported?

Last edited by nahkhiirmees (2024-06-14 09:50:09)

Offline

Board footer