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#1526 Re: Hardware & System Configuration » (core2duo workstation) NVIDIA Quadro FX 770 m - devuan reasonable? » 2020-09-26 23:20:19

Hello:

kapqa wrote:

... workstation laptop with dualcore2duo cpu and NVIDIA Quadro FX 770 m.

Unless I am mistaken, you can install ascii or Beowulf and the non-free 340XX legacy drivers with no issues.

See here https://www.nvidia.com/en-us/drivers/unix/legacy-gpu/ ...

link@Nvidia.com wrote:

The 340.xx driver supports the following set of GPUs.
NVIDIA GPU product     Device PCI ID
--- snip ------------------------------------
Quadro FX 770M                0x065C
--- snip ------------------------------------

... and here https://nvidia.custhelp.com/app/answers … /a_id/3142

Devuan will be a great choice for your workstation.
Fit a fast solid state drive and as much memory as it will accept and it will fly.

Cheers,

A.

#1527 Re: Installation » Beowulf - Unknown group 'kvm'. » 2020-09-26 18:01:04

Hello:

Head_on_a_Stick wrote:

... patch to eudev so that only root and members of the kvm group can edit the node ...

Please correct me if I am wrong ...

Am I to understand that the Alpine distribution has issued a patch that basically backpedals on what Poettering so stubbornly pushed through?
And that in doing so, the line in dmesg complaining about group 'kvm' not being found is then not generated by the system?

TIA

A.

#1528 Re: Installation » Beowulf - Unknown group 'kvm'. » 2020-09-26 17:04:02

Hello:

Head_on_a_Stick wrote:

No, the kvm group is one of the kernel developers' ideas.

You are quite right, I did not express myself correctly.
I should have written: ... seems that setting the /dev/kdm to world-read-write was ...

Head_on_a_Stick wrote:

... allows users to access hardware virtualisation (via /dev/kvm) if they are a member of the group.

Why not do it when installing qemu-kvm?
Not a question that I bring up for I would have not known of its existence if I had not looked at my dmesg, which I always do.

It was so out of place that a maintainer actually filed it as a bug. (see the thread I linked to)

Head_on_a_Stick wrote:

... Alpine system creates the group when the qemu package is installed ...

Yes, as it should (if it needs it, obviously).
Right?

Head_on_a_Stick wrote:

... why is a random error message so important?

Because ...

... it is there?
... people who know much more than I have made what seems to be a strong case against it being there/generated?
... the (seemingly valid) arguments against this were railroaded by Poettering?

Isn't that how systemd came to be?

You may or may not agree with me, but it is not so much what is there but how it got to be there.

Head_on_a_Stick wrote:

... ignoring it is a definite option ...
... creating the kvm group manually would be better than editing ...

I agree.

Altoid @20200923 14:58:29 wrote:

Should I create a 'kvm' group to get rid of the dmesg line?

Thanks so much for your input.

Cheers,

A.

#1529 Re: Installation » Beowulf - Unknown group 'kvm'. » 2020-09-26 13:48:52

Hello:

ralph.ronnquist wrote:

... hotplug event generated when the "kvm subsystem" ...
... by the hotplug handler (aka udev/eudev) via that "rule"
... to create the device node "/dev/kvm" with the particular permissions and group.

I think I got the right idea.  =^)

ralph.ronnquist wrote:

... same actions by hand ...:

# mknod /dev/kvm c 10 232   <- this was also done in ascii
# chmod 0666 /dev/kvm        <- not this
# chgrp kvm /dev/kvm           <- not this
ralph.ronnquist wrote:

Commenting out the rule ...
... absence of the device node
... not the sub system itself ...

Just commenting out chmod 0666 /dev/kvm and chgrp kvm /dev/kvm (reported as a bug in the thread I linked to) should suffice. 

ralph.ronnquist wrote:

... until there's some software needing it ...

From what I have read (not nearly enough) it seems that it is something used solely by the qemu-kvm package.

eg: I run a couple of VMs via VirtualBox in my ascii installation

groucho@devuan:~$ uname -a
Linux devuan 4.9.0-13-amd64 #1 SMP Debian 4.9.228-1 (2020-07-05) x86_64 GNU/Linux
groucho@devuan:~$ 

The node is there:     (the cpu-checker package does not seem to be in the ascii repository)

~$ ls /dev/kvm
/dev/kvm
~$ 

I don't have a 'kvm' group:

~$ grep kvm /etc/group
~$ 
ralph.ronnquist wrote:

... ideal modularization principle, the device node would rather be created as needed by that software ...

Yes, under the modularization principles that governed Debian development and maintenance from the start, crap like this would never have happened.
Nor would a thread as the one I linked to even existed.

That's where we are.

Thanks a lot for your input.

Cheers,

A.

#1530 Re: Installation » Beowulf - Unknown group 'kvm'. » 2020-09-26 08:58:54

Hello:

larsH wrote:

Hi
What about "apt purge qemu-kvm".
... get rid of configuration files of all previously installed ...

I don't think that would have any effect.
The qemu-kvm package was never installed and I think what is happening is not because of configuration file from the qemu-kvm installation.

~# apt purge qemu-kvm
Reading package lists... Done
Building dependency tree       
Reading state information... Done
Package 'qemu-kvm' is not installed, so not removed
0 upgraded, 0 newly installed, 0 to remove and 0 not upgraded.
~# 

Normally, the qemu-kvm package would set up a 'kvm' group and set up user r+w access to /dev/kvm.

For reasons that do not seem at all clear, this has changed in Beowulf.

Like ralph.ronnquist points out, now the system has a default udev rule (set up at OS install time and overwritten on every update) that wants to set /dev/kvm to world-read-write.

I expect that it also wants a 'kvm' group and not finding it, prints out the result in dmesg

At least that is how I understand it, corrections welcome.  =-)

Cheers,

A.

#1531 Re: Installation » Beowulf - Unknown group 'kvm'. » 2020-09-25 23:36:15

Hello:

ralph.ronnquist wrote:

... surgery of /lib/udev/rules.d/50-udev-default.rules might be sufficient ...

Right.
I'll try that.

But ...
The file starts like this:

# do not edit this file, it will be overwritten on update
# The static_node is required on s390x and ppc (they are using MODULE_ALIAS)
KERNEL=="kvm", GROUP="kvm", MODE="0666", OPTIONS+="static_node=kvm"

Is this ^^ the line?
I guess I could comment out the whole line, see what happens and remember when an update comes along.

Q: isn't s390x a 64bit IBM mainframe and PPC PowerPC?
ie: need a diiferent kernel than the one (amd64) we're using?
If so, what valid motive is there for this 'kvm' group thing?   

I'm not a maintainer, coder or even an advanced user but I get a bad feeling when I see things like these being done in this manner ie: just because.
From reading the thread I linked to I cannot but suspect that, coming from systemd's creator, there may be something else behind this.
But then that's just me.

Thanks for your input.

A.

#1532 Re: Installation » Beowulf - Unknown group 'kvm'. » 2020-09-25 22:45:34

Hello:

Head_on_a_Stick wrote:

Better command:

grep kvm /etc/group

See also http://porkmail.org/era/unix/award.html#cat

I'll have a read.
But you know I have a thing for cats.  8^D

Head_on_a_Stick wrote:

Do you have QEMU installed?

No.

Head_on_a_Stick wrote:

... the qemu-kvm package creates that system group.

Yes, but if I'm not installing qemu ...

Head_on_a_Stick wrote:

Does that [VMWare] use KVM for hardware virtualisation?

Apparently not.
From what I make from the thread linked below, only the qemu package uses it.

I found a bug report from 2017 with respect to this here -> https://github.com/systemd/systemd/issues/6360

It would seem that PR #5597 introduced a rule for /dev/kvm in Debian unstable, the result of which is the line in dmesg and someone filed the bug report.

This now causes a journal error.

systemd-udevd: Specified group 'kvm' unknown

in any place where it doesn't exist. That could be initrds, non-x86 systems (which don't have this concept) or simply machines which don't have QEMU installed, where it doesn't make sense to create the group. "kvm" is not at all a generally useful and LSB defined standard group, so creating it everywhere seems like a waste.

What the OP wrote makes (to me) a lot of sense, more so if we take into account that there seem to be no applications which would need a system generated 'kvm' group save the qemu package.

The thread is really worth a read.

It seems this 'kvm' group was another one of Poettering's brilliant ideas.
And as such, it was shoved through in the usual fashion:

Anyway, I am very sure that /dev/kvm should be considered a standard system concept now, sharedby apps, and generic enough to be set up by systemd properly. I hope this makes some sense, and will close this now...

There you have it.
That's how we got a systemd-udevd: Specified group 'kvm' unknown line in dmesg.

@Poettering: no [asshole], it does not make any sense.

Cheers,

A.

#1533 Installation » Beowulf - Unknown group 'kvm'. » 2020-09-25 17:58:29

Altoid
Replies: 13

Hello:

While trawling log files to fine tune my new Beowulf, I found this in my dmesg output:

--- snip ---
[   14.484174] udevd[395]: specified group 'kvm' unknown
--- snip ---

Quite so, the group 'kvm' does not exist ...

~$ cat /etc/group | grep -i kvm
~$ 

... so I guess it is unknown.

I have seen some chatter on the web with respect to this but as it seems (?) Poettering is involved, I decided to ask here.
ie: people argued against and he argued for.

I installed cpu-checker and ran it ...

~# kvm-ok
INFO: /dev/kvm exists
KVM acceleration can be used
~#

... confirming that /dev/kdm is there.
Why?

I run my VMs with VMWare but have not installed it yet.
Why does the kernel/system generate /dev/kvm and but does not also generate a 'kvm' group, maybe just empty?

Should I create a 'kvm' group to get rid of the dmesg line?

Thanks in advance,

A.

#1534 Re: Installation » Refracta2usb not in Beowulf repo? » 2020-09-24 20:51:00

Hello:

fsmithred wrote:

... installer includes Recommends by default.

I see.

Not so 'bare-bones' as I expected a net-install to be.

fsmithred wrote:

... switch to another virtual console with alt-F2 during the install and make a 00norecommends file in /etc/apt/apt.conf.d/ that contains 

APT::Install-Recommends "no";

... after the package manager is configured but before tasksel starts installing packages.
alt-F1 to get back to the installer.

Thanks for the heads-up, good to know.
I'm not doing installations so often, but I'll keep it in mind.

On the other hand, maybe it would be easier to make a list of the Recommends included in the net-install and a script to purge them when the installation is finished and you are logged in as root for the first time.

Followed by a double portion of apt install -f ...   8^D !!!
Just in case.

Thanks for your input.

Cheers,

A.

#1535 Re: Installation » Refracta2usb not in Beowulf repo? » 2020-09-24 16:57:15

Hello:

fsmithred wrote:

Refracta tools have never been in the debian ...
... refracta2usb won't be in the devuan repo until I clean up the code.

OK.

fsmithred wrote:

... ugly code, but it still works.

Indeed ...   =^)

fsmithred wrote:

... dread making any changes ...

I know that feeling too well ...

fsmithred wrote:

... get rid of live-tools. It's not needed.
Install without Recommends ...

The Beowulf installation I'm working on is a net-install which I expected to be bare-bones by design.
But live-tools seems to have been installed either by the net-install installation process itself or something else.

~$ apt list | grep -i live-tools
live-tools/stable,now 1:20171207 all [installed,automatic]  <--- came with what?
~$ su -

I certainly don't recall installing it.

I've removed it as per your suggestion.
Did not drag anything along with it.   =^)

fsmithred wrote:

Cryptsetup is infinitely more useful.

I'll keep it.

Thanks for your input.

Cheers,

A.

#1536 Re: Installation » Refracta2usb not in Beowulf repo? » 2020-09-24 14:19:08

Hello:

golinux wrote:

... like it's ever been ...

Seems so.

Any idea why?
ie: why Debian does not have it in its repository?

golinux wrote:

... get it here.

Thanks a lot.  8⁾)

What can you tell me about the warning messages?
ie: update-rc.d and cryptsetup.

Cheers,

A.

#1537 Re: Desktop and Multimedia » 'Drop to terminal' question » 2020-09-24 14:15:33

Hello:

Head_on_a_Stick wrote:

... that's right.
... startx command will run whatever desktop environment is symlinked ...
... can be overridden by creating ~/.xsession or ~/.xinitrc, see startx(1) for more on this.

Right.

Head_on_a_Stick wrote:

... Sorry for the delayed response ...

No problem whatsoever.
Thanks a lot for your input.

Cheers,

A.

#1538 Installation » Refracta2usb not in Beowulf repo? » 2020-09-23 22:38:36

Altoid
Replies: 7

Hello:

Can't find refracta2usb in the Beowulf repository.
I recall the same thing happening when I wanted to install it in ascii but cannot recall how that got solved.

Also ...

On installing refractasnapshot-gui I got these warnings:

---
Setting up live-tools (1:20171207) ...
update-rc.d: warning: start and stop actions are no longer supported; falling back to defaults
update-rc.d: warning: start runlevel arguments (none) do not match live-tools Default-Start values (S)
Setting up uuid-runtime (2.33.1-0.1+devuan1~beowulf2) ...
Adding group `uuidd' (GID 118) ...
Done.

Warning: The home dir /run/uuidd you specified can't be accessed: No such file or directory
Adding system user `uuidd' (UID 111) ...
Adding new user `uuidd' (UID 111) with group `uuidd' ...
Not creating home directory `/run/uuidd'.
Warning: The home dir /run/uuidd you specified can't be accessed: No such file or directory

So I checked and found a uuidd group so I added myself to it.

The directory /run/uuidd exists.

/$ locate /run/uuidd
/run/uuidd
/run/uuidd/request
/run/uuidd/uuidd.pid
/$ 

Is there something I should do about the update-rc.d: warnings?

I also got this:

cryptsetup: WARNING: The initramfs image may not contain cryptsetup binaries 
nor crypto modules. If that's on purpose, you may want to uninstall the 
'cryptsetup-initramfs' package in order to disable the cryptsetup initramfs 
integration and avoid this warning.

Should I uninstall the 'cryptsetup-initramfs' package?
I'm not using encryption (for now) but would need it if I eventually decide to use tomb.
Although not sure it is worth it as it is described as being for fairly strong encryption.

Thanks in advance,

A.

#1539 Re: Desktop and Multimedia » 'Drop to terminal' question » 2020-09-22 22:48:52

Hello:

Head_on_a_Stick wrote:

... login screen) will launch the graphical desktop on TTY7 by default ...

Right.

So, when I drop to a terminal via  Ctrl+Alt+F1 I will be on TTY1 (or TTYn depending on the Fn used) save for TTY7 which is already running and which I get back to by means of Ctrl+Alt+F7. Yes?

Thanks for the explanation.

Cheers,

A.

#1540 Desktop and Multimedia » 'Drop to terminal' question » 2020-09-22 19:52:11

Altoid
Replies: 4

Hello:

I know that Ctrl+Alt+F1 will drop me to a log-in terminal and that Ctrl+Alt+F7 will get me back to the desktop.
But I don't have much of a clue as to what is happening 'behind the scenes' so to speak.

eg:
How does getting a terminal with Ctrl+Alt+F1 relate to booting to a log-in terminal, logging in, doing startx and opening up a terminal as root?

If I start a terminal with Ctrl+Alt+F1, log in and and then do startx, are there two users (both me) with the same userid or am I being taken to my original desktop?

Rather confused as to how it works.

Thanks in advance,

A.

#1541 Re: Forum Feedback » Unable to edit any of my own posts » 2020-09-22 13:47:57

Hello:

Vernon wrote:

... which would prove your critics correct that Devuan is more about tantrums ...
... changing editing times instead of leaving well enough alone.

I find the tone in your posts to be both unwarranted and out of place, a view that I expect many here at Dev1 share.

I would personally appreciate your showing more respect to those who volunteer their work to keep this site working.

Thank you.

A.

#1542 Re: Forum Feedback » Unable to edit any of my own posts » 2020-09-21 23:55:08

Hello:

ralph.ronnquist wrote:

... discussion site becomes a wiki site merely by claiming that it is one.

+1

ralph.ronnquist wrote:

... proclaim that a discussion site is an uninteresting extra and close it down ...

Please don't.

ralph.ronnquist wrote:

... the benefit of allowing such editing well outweighs the risk of communal loss ...

It does not.

However small the risk of communal loss may seem, it is far too much if it is communal loss of any sort.

Just my $0.02

A.

#1543 Re: Installation » Linux - Locale conundrum » 2020-09-21 21:59:04

Hello:

Altoid wrote:

... get back later on.

Apparently it is all fixed.
I'll have to see how things go with the logfiles and MSOffice/LibreOffice stuff.

~$ cat /etc/default/keyboard
# KEYBOARD CONFIGURATION FILE
# Consult the keyboard(5) manual page.

XKBMODEL="pc105"
XKBLAYOUT="latam"
XKBVARIANT="deadtilde"
XKBOPTIONS="lv3:ralt_switch,terminate:ctrl_alt_bksp"

BACKSPACE="guess"
~$ 

Took me a while because I was incorrectly setting nodeadtilde, fussing up the layout.

~$ cat /etc/default/locale
#  File generated by update-locale
LANG=en_GB.UTF-8
#LANGUAGE=en_GB.UTF-8
LC_CTYPE="en_GB.UTF-8"
LC_NUMERIC="en_GB.UTF-8"
LC_TIME="en_GB.UTF.8"
LC_COLLATE="en_GB.UTF-8"
# LC_MONETARY="en_GB.UTF-8"
LC_MESSAGES="en_GB.UTF-8"
LC_PAPER="en_GB.UTF-8"
LC_NAME="en_GB.UTF-8"
LC_ADDRESS="en_GB.UTF-8"
LC_TELEPHONE="en_GB.UTF-8"
LC_MEASUREMENT="en_GB.UTF-8"
LC_IDENTIFICATION="en_GB.UTF-8"
LC_ALL=
~$ 
~$ locale -a
C
C.UTF-8
en_GB.utf8
es_AR.utf8
POSIX
~$ 

For future reference in case anyone else comes across a similar problem, this is the keyboard layout -> http://kbdlayout.info/KBDLA/
No, I don't use a MS kb. this web page is very useful (has scan codes, virtual keys, etc.) and references to kbdla.dll which is a MS file. 8^P

Thanks for your input.

Cheers,

A.

#1544 Re: Installation » Linux - Locale conundrum » 2020-09-21 18:58:04

Hello:

Head_on_a_Stick wrote:

... excellent.

Thanks. =-)
Methinks rather lacking in volcabulary.

Head_on_a_Stick wrote:

... tried selecting UTF-8 as the encoding?

Yes.

Head_on_a_Stick wrote:

... log files need root ...

I was opening them as root.

Head_on_a_Stick wrote:
# dpkg-reconfigure locales keyboard-configuration

Ahh .....

I was doing dpkg-reconfigure keyboard-configuration and dpkg-reconfigure locales and not dpkg-reconfigure locales keyboard-configuration.
So I was getting errors.

I'll try this and get back later on.

Thanks for your input.

A.

#1545 Installation » Linux - Locale conundrum » 2020-09-20 19:59:11

Altoid
Replies: 3

Hello:

I have an unsolved issue of sorts involving locale settings which I have not been able to get around for the longest while.

A short explanation is in order.

My mother tongue is Spanish, my second language being English.

My exposure to IT was from the very start in English and for some reason I have never been to feel comfortable with IT in Spanish.
Notwithstanding, when I work with others in IT in my mother tongue and as trhere are words to explain most everything, I insist that the proper Spanish terms be used.
One of my pet peeves.

Being my initial exposure to IT in English all the OSs I have ever used, from DOS back in the day onwards to Linux today have been/are in English.

But ...

My time zone is GMT -03:00, my date/time format of choice is DD/MM/YYYY - HH:MM:SS and because I work in the two languages I speak (occassionally dabbling in French) I have preferred a keyboard layout that has most if not all the needed letters and symbols. ie: Latin American with the standard 105-key layout and then some (if I can remember where they are).

eg:

         | 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 0 ' ¿
Shift ° ! " # $ % & / ( ) = ? ¡
AltGr ¬ | @ · ~ ½ ¬ { [ ] } \ ¸

         q w e r t y u i o p ' +
Shift Q W E R T Y U I O P " *
AtGr @ ł € ¶ ŧ ← ↓ → ø þ " ~

         a s d f g h j k l ñ { }
Shift A S D F G H J K L Ñ [ ]
AltGr æ ß ð đ ŋ ħ̉ ̉  ĸ ł ~ ^ `

        < z x c v b n m , . -
Shift > Z X C V B N M ; : _
AltGr « » ¢ “ ” n µ   · ̣

There are sometimes problems related to the opening/saving of spreadsheets (MSOffice/Libre Office) and the /var/log/ files which can be parsed in a terminal but not be seen properly with some editors due to ISO encodings.

eg: Pluma + /var/log/auth.log, kern.log, messages ...

pluma has not been able to detect the character encoding.
Please check that you are not trying to open a binary file.
Select a character encoding from the menu and try again.

Basically, what I want is that my Linux box be 100% in English (en-GB preferred), be able to use the keyboard layout I need and be able to look at log files with an editor without problems.

Any suggestions?

Thanks in advance,

A.

#1546 Re: Forum Feedback » Unable to edit any of my own posts » 2020-09-20 13:20:06

Hello:

yeti wrote:

Re: Changed context after reply
... always quote the relevant parts.

Always do that and (of course) never top post.
So I instantly realised what had transpired.

Cheers,

A.

#1547 Re: Forum Feedback » Unable to edit any of my own posts » 2020-09-20 00:27:23

Hello:

golinux wrote:

... suggest time limits for consideration.

I think that posts which have not received an answer should have no time limit for edition by the OP, who should also be able to delete it if deemed necessary.

But, if a post has received an answer the OP should not be able to delete it.

With respect to editing a post that has received an answer, I'd say that it depends on the forum.

I have had a forum member (not here, of course ...) edit his original post and in doing so make my answer look out of place.
ie: like if I was replying to something that he did not write, to the extent of making me doubt for a second as to what I had read.

It's only happened to me once in more that 20 years of participating in different fora, but I found it to be rather unsettling.

I'm sure that here at Dev1 it could be allowed (with the provision of automatic edit notices) for as long as it takes for a second reply to come in.
From the on, that particular post would be closed to editing.

Make sense?

Cheers,

A.

#1548 Re: Installation » [Solved] Beowulf - Nvidia legacy 340XX driver will not install. » 2020-09-17 23:40:01

Hello:

GlennW wrote:

Thank you for documenting ...

You're welcome ...

But the merit is all HeavyDevy's.
I would not have known where to start.

Cheers,

A.

#1549 Re: Installation » [Solved] Beowulf - Nvidia legacy 340XX driver will not install. » 2020-09-17 16:11:56

Hello:

HevyDevy wrote:

... the debian wiki guide that this needs to be done as a separate set of commands/instruction ...

I see ...

But I have not had to do this in any of the other instances where I installed these same legacy-340xx drivers in other Linux distributons.

It did not happen when I moved from Linux Mint to a fresh Devuan Jesse installation either.
So why does it happen now in Beowulf?

The legacy-340xx driver is in the Beowulf distribution just as it was in the Jesse distribution.

Thanks for the heads-up, I'll keep the link in the Devuan bookmarks folder.

Once again, thanks for your help.
I certainly would not have my three screens in Beowulf without it.

Cheers,

A.

#1550 Re: Installation » [Solved] Beowulf - Nvidia legacy 340XX driver will not install. » 2020-09-17 13:43:48

Hello:

HevyDevy wrote:

... install the linux-headers first, i dont know ...

I would think that anything that was needed by the installer would have been listed as a dependency.
Or a warning that linux-headers were not installed issued and the installation aborted.

HevyDevy wrote:

... definetly something buggy going on due to that nvidia-persistenced ...

Indeed ...
There was that post last year to which I made reference in this thread.
But it seems no one at Debian took notice.

HevyDevy wrote:

... few of the steps i did were probably not needed ...
... depmod, update-initramfs and update-grub ...

Well ...
And it got me through. ;- )

I worry things such as these ie: a severely broken installation, don't get looked at by maintainers.
I expect to be using the same box with the same perfectly working video cards when I switch to Ceres.

Cheers,

A.

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