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#1 Re: News & Announcements » Migrating from Buster to Beowulf - feedback needed » 2019-09-09 12:33:11

Not to get too far off topic about migrating from buster to beowulf...


You are correct that network-manager has not been devuanized in beowulf, but I'm not sure if it needs to be done.

You are correct.  I just removed the "hold" in apt and did an update.  It worked fine.  I did have one instance where an important file in NetworkManager was removed because it was "obsolete".  I replaced it and it works fine, so, for anyone reading this, backup the contents of /etc/NetworkManager before updating.  Better safe than sorry! 
The NM update worked fine in going from Beowulf to Ceres also.

Toxic >

I would recommend to install wicd instead of nm as a temporary solution.

I agree about Wicd, but I like using NetworkManager for the VPN gui.  It makes the vpn so easy to switch on and off.

Now back on topic...

#2 Re: News & Announcements » Migrating from Buster to Beowulf - feedback needed » 2019-09-07 17:16:36

Also, I would add that Network-Manager has not been devuanized in the Beowulf repository, yet.  If I am incorrect, then I appologize, but I was just unaware of this since I have the ascii version marked as "hold" in apt and it has not upgraded.  If you install NM from scratch, you can install it from the ascii repository and it will work.  I have been using this setup for quite some time.

If you already have it installed and working in buster, then you will probably have to remove it completely and then install it from the ascii repository, preferably after updating everything else. 

NM is the only program that I use that has not been devuanized for beowulf, yet.  I do not know of any others.

#3 Re: News & Announcements » Migrating from Buster to Beowulf - feedback needed » 2019-09-07 02:44:31

I have been playing with this most of the day.  The instructions mentioned here still work, for the most part on a netinst install with no X system.  There may be a slight change, but it is still workable.  Commands were entered from a ssh session into the Vbox VM as much as possible.

I just successfully completed a migration from debian buster, it was not easy to do.  Since I really didn't know what I was doing, I  went by trial and error mostly.  I am sure there are other ways to do this, but this worked for me.  Hopefully, someone who knows more about this can shorten and simplify this migration from buster to beowulf.

I started with the debian v.10 netinst cd (with firmware) and then I installed xfce4 with

apt install xfce4

And I rebooted just so I could be starting from a fresh boot.

Edit:  Just today, Sept. 7, 2019, debian updated from 10.0 to 10.1 which brought in a new kernel and 60 upgraded packages.  I did a dist-upgrade and reboot to start from a 10.1 starting point.

Boot into "debian",   

apt update
apt install sysvinit-core

Do not reboot, yet.

# alter /root/.bashrc and add:

export PATH=/usr/local/sbin:/usr/local/bin:/usr/sbin:/usr/bin:/sbin:/bin

# logout from this ssh session and login to a new ssh session, this loads the new PATH

Installed devuan-keyring

wget wget
dpkg -i devuan-keyring_2017.10.03_all.deb

Alter the sources.list to devuan, and then

apt update
apt upgrade

(I do not know what made me try this, as I was just going on a hunch and trying something else.  I was having a hard time getting sysvinit-core installed, especially from the devuan repos.  Once I installed it from the debian repos, and updated it from the devuan repos, within the same boot, it worked easier.)

# first reboot


(takes a long time to boot due to starting dbus.  It hangs for ~1-2 minutes

(takes longer to login to either the physical terminal or a ssh session, to both user and root account)

(does not boot to X session, only to terminal, but this was temporary)

apt install eudev

(takes a lot longer to "Process triggers for dbus", ~4 minutes, hangs at "Progress... 96%")
("Failed to open connection to "system" message bus: Did not receive a reply. Possible causes include: the remote application did not send a reply, the message bus security policy blocked the reply, the reply timeout expired, or the network connection was broken.")

# network will not work unless you change interfaces file:
# alter /etc/network/interfaces file to change enp0s3 to:

auto eth0
iface eth0 inet dhcp

# second reboot

apt install libelogind0
apt remove systemd* --purge
apt remove libnss-systemd --purge
apt remove dbus-user-session --purge

# lightdm was removed earlier, so:

apt install lightdm --no-install-recommends

# at this point, there was some kind of issue with libpolkit-agent-1-0, as it was the only package showing as upgradable:

root@localhost:/home/guest# apt list --upgradable -a
Listing... Done
libpolkit-agent-1-0/testing 0.105-25+devuan4 amd64 [upgradable from: 0.105-25]
libpolkit-agent-1-0/now 0.105-25 amd64 [installed,upgradable to: 0.105-25+devuan4]

# I noticed that policykit-1 was shown as a recommended package to lightdm, so

apt install policykit-1 --no-install-recommends

# and this updated the libpolkit-agent-1-0 package

# probably could have done this earlier, but I finally discarded the unnecessary stuff

apt autoremove

# third reboot


The end result:

root@localhost:/home/guest# apt dist-upgrade
Reading package lists... Done
Building dependency tree       
Reading state information... Done
Calculating upgrade... Done
0 upgraded, 0 newly installed, 0 to remove and 0 not upgraded.

# no systemd here!

root@localhost:/home/guest# dpkg -l | grep systemd

# At the Xfce desktop, all logout options appear available and are not greyed out.

# On the Grub boot menu, it says Debian, and an "update-grub" does not fix it.

#4 Re: Devuan Derivatives » AVMultimedia with Devuan Beowulf: A powerful RAM based desktop » 2019-09-04 11:57:18

Sorry, my language is German and the german text was automaticially translated into English.

Thank you for clarifying.  I will give it a test run.

#6 Re: Devuan Derivatives » [MiyoLinux] Update on the Update Notifier » 2019-09-03 14:37:59

If anyone has any input or suggestions, I would appreciate it.

Available for download?

#7 Re: Hardware & System Configuration » installation Nextcloud » 2019-08-15 13:38:55

give "www-data" permissions to Nextcloud but it was given to the whole system, the issue is that I have no idea how to fix that.

Just to be clear did you change the permissions for all files in the operating system or just the files of the nextcloud install?  If you did, then I would suggest reinstalling the operating system.

What I do is to make the <user> the files owner and then set "www-data" as the group owner.  Then I add the <user> to the "www-data" group.  Finally, I change the chmod of the files to 0775 so that both the files owner and www-data group have read and write ability of the files.  To do this, I only have a single user system with no other user accounts. 

I would be interested in somebody else adding their input on a proper way to set the permissions in a multi-user system.  I have spent some time searching the web for similar information but what I have found mentioned is somewhat conflicting.  Some say to make the user "www-data" the owner of the files, but I am unsure about that.

#8 Re: Hardware & System Configuration » installation Nextcloud » 2019-08-12 21:07:09

There are a lot of tutorials and examples on the 'net.  I found this one which is relatively new and it may be of assistance.  It is for Debian 10, but it followed closely the steps that I took to install it.  The only change is the command to restart the apache service, which the article states as

sudo systemctl restart apache2

but should be

service apache2 restart

The web updater has improved a lot over the past few versions.  If I may say so, please remember to back up your NC install (files, data, and database) before updating as it may have mishaps.  Good luck with it!

#9 Re: Installation » Migrate from Debian 10 to Devuan » 2019-07-29 20:23:19

fsr is looking out for your best interests by not giving you any instructions.  However, if you are seriously interested in this and don't mind ruining the Debian 10 install that you have, then I will provide you with a link that may, just may, help you out some.

Forum link

This was done on a minimal install with no X system, and I would change one command from this

apt install sysvinit

to this,

apt install sysvinit-core

Also, backup your debian 10 install before trying this.  You will be in untested territory here, so there may not be much help that even could be provided.  It will either work, or it won't.  Good Luck.


#10 Re: DIY » When will/was Beowulf stable enough to move to? » 2019-07-02 14:28:18

when did or will Beowulf become safer to use than ceres

I don't know that there is an "exact" answer to that.  However, for me Beowulf took a major turn toward stability a few months ago when libelogind was presented.  Since then, I have had only theme (xfce) related problems which were minor.  Now, when the Network-Manager packages get sanitized, then I will remove the ascii block on them and then I will be 100% beowulf. 

But since Ceres has been working so well for so long, I will only be using my Beowulf partition if and when ceres stumbles.

#11 Re: Off-topic » » 2019-06-28 21:44:03

# df -h
Filesystem      Size  Used Avail Use% Mounted on
udev            485M     0  485M   0% /dev
tmpfs           100M  340K  100M   1% /run
/dev/vda1        25G  5.2G   20G  21% /
tmpfs           5.0M     0  5.0M   0% /run/lock
tmpfs           200M     0  200M   0% /run/shm

On the last line I see /run/shm, but no /dev/shm

#12 Re: Off-topic » » 2019-06-28 13:07:31

Devuan lets me work my way up from scratch

I hear you on that.  It is my preferred way to build, not desktop install and then removing stuff.

Question, on my desktop, this works fine.  But on another system I get this error.  Any ideas on what is missing?

$ sudo
  File "/usr/local/sbin/", line 448
    "%s: Shared memory is not reporte
SyntaxError: EOL while scanning string literal

The difference between the two systems is that the one that works is a desktop install.  The other is a virtual machine, devuan (ascii) on vultr.

Python is installed:

python is already the newest version (2.7.13-2).

#13 Re: Other Issues » How do I upgrade to latest Devuan [SOLVED] » 2019-06-15 11:12:08

First, backup your data before you do anything so that you can get back to where you are now.

If you have been keeping your install up to date, then you may be surprised to know that there is nothing at all to do.  If not, then it may be a rather large update and it may be better to do it from a console outside of an X-desktop.  From the destop, press "Ctrl + Alt + F1" to get to a console.  When finished, press "Ctrl + Alt + F7" to return to the desktop screen.

I would make sure that your /etc/apt/sources.list file points to the correct repository address at, and then do an

apt update


apt-get update


apt dist-upgrade


apt-get dist-upgrade

If everything works, and it probably will, you are good to go.  However, there may be some changes to a configuration file of a package between the beta. rc, and release versions.  This could cause a problem.

If you do have a problem, you could try to either uninstall the offending program ("apt remove <program> --purge") and then reinstall.    This could be tricky depending on dependencies, so use caution.  Another possible option would be to use "dpkg-reconfigure <program>" instead of --purge.  These two methods will rebuild the configuration file of a program.

If something breaks and it becomes unusable, then reinstall.  It is not that big of a deal, especially if you have your system (/home folder) backed up.  Refracta-tools is your friend here, along with rsync.  Again, backup your data before changing anything, especially if it will be a large update.

I have a feeling that you have been keeping your system up to date and then there is probably nothing that you need to do.  But I would make sure that the correct url address is present in the sources.list file and change this if needed.

#14 Re: Off-topic » Google search gives DEVUAN as DEAD ? » 2019-06-06 23:12:36

I just did a quick search for "devuan" in google and all the hits on the first page were directly related to devuan not debian. 

As a matter of fact, I see this as a direct improvement over the past as usually it will have a line just under the search entry stating somethine like,  "Did you mean debian?"  And even this did not show.  This means to me that google is allowing for a greater divergence between the two.

Not disagreeing with you, just reporting what I see on google where I am at.

#15 Re: Other Issues » doesn't get updates for Jessie, auto.mirror.devuan does » 2019-05-09 02:16:55

Just to include a quick check to duplicate what haary, the original poster, is reporting.  I have a jessie server operational using the address in my sources.list which has not received any updates in a while and it too reports that

root@Am-VPN:/etc/apt# apt-get update
All packages are up to date.

However, when I change the url in the sources.list file to "", it shows updates available:

The following packages will be upgraded:
  libjs-jquery libsystemd0 libudev1 udev wget

So, the old "" address is showing updates available, while the newer "" is showing no updates available.  "https" in the url is not even involved here.

As an example using the program wget, which is shown as one of the programs that could be upgraded - with no upgrade is showing:

root@Am-VPN:/etc/apt# apt-cache policy wget
  Installed: 1.16-1+deb8u5
  Candidate: 1.16-1+deb8u5
  Version table:
 *** 1.16-1+deb8u5 0
        500 jessie/main amd64 Packages
        100 /var/lib/dpkg/status

However, using "", it does pick up the upgradeable program:

root@Am-VPN:/etc/apt# apt-cache policy wget
  Installed: 1.16-1+deb8u5
  Candidate: 1.16-1+deb8u6
  Version table:
     1.16-1+deb8u6 0
        500 jessie-security/main amd64 Packages
 *** 1.16-1+deb8u5 0
        500 jessie/main amd64 Packages
        100 /var/lib/dpkg/status

It appears that is not picking up the jessie-security updates section of the repo.  This is my sources.list.  I alternated between the two url addresses, of course.

deb jessie main contrib non-free
#deb jessie main contrib non-free

deb jessie-security main contrib non-free
#deb jessie-security main contrib non-free

deb jessie-updates main contrib non-free
#deb jessie-updates main contrib non-free

#16 Re: Other Issues » Is the debian/devuan merge working right? » 2019-04-21 15:34:00

I do not know, but I am wondering if this is a related issue?

This link to the main amprolla file shows this at the bottom:

2019/04/21 14:45:47 [WARN] … ents-arm64 failed: 404
2019/04/21 14:45:47 [WARN] … 28x128.tar failed: 404
2019/04/21 14:45:49 [WARN] … -amd64.yml failed: 404
2019/04/21 14:45:54 [WARN] … ps64el.yml failed: 404
2019/04/21 14:49:40 [WARN] … ce/Sources failed: 404
2019/04/21 14:49:40 [WARN] … nts-source failed: 404
2019/04/21 14:49:43 [INFO] Total incremental update time: 582.1237125396729
2019/04/21 14:50:08 [INFO] Total incremental update time: 7.0341596603393555
2019/04/21 14:55:04 [INFO] Total incremental update time: 2.9968421459198
2019/04/21 15:00:14 [INFO] Total incremental update time: 12.597147226333618
2019/04/21 15:05:04 [INFO] Total incremental update time: 3.4688239097595215
2019/04/21 15:10:04 [INFO] Total incremental update time: 2.7986111640930176
2019/04/21 15:15:05 [INFO] Total incremental update time: 4.079205751419067

Many, if not all packages currently show a "failed: 404", meaning, file is not found.

On my systems it shows no updates available so it does not try to download anything.  However, I have also tried to update a beowulf and ceres install with no updates showing as available.  Having no updates available for ceres (or beowulf) over a three day period is highly unusual.  This could be that my systems were up to date when things went away.  With the absence of no official word, I am merely offering one possible explanation.

#17 Re: DIY » Migration from debian buster to devuan beowulf can work » 2019-04-15 15:49:53

It looks like you were able to do an upgrade in devuan while running systemd.

Actually, you may be are correct.  I did not notice that.  I think you are referring to the first "apt upgrade", yes that was while using systemd.  I thought that would only pull in the stuff that was not requiring systemd.  In total, there were only 10 or 12 packages pulled in.  I just had to find a good step by step so that apt could do it right.

fsr > In case you are interested, I will email you the note that I made of the steps and terminal output.  I finally got it to work one time and I did it again, step by step, to make sure that the steps were correct. 

I really was not expecting it to work at all.  Before this test, I also did a stretch to ascii migration and it was much easier.

#18 DIY » Migration from debian buster to devuan beowulf can work » 2019-04-15 01:03:47

Replies: 4

I haven't read anything on a debian buster to devuan beowulf migration anywhere.  I was wondering if it was possible.  So, not having much to do today, I thought I would give it a try.  To my surprise, it did work, utilizing a minimal install.  It was not quite as simple as a single "apt dist-upgrade" command, but I did get it to work using a trial and error "path".  I do not claim this to be clean or as simple as it could be, like a jessie to jessie migration, or even a stretch to ascii migration.  I only wanted to report that it did work, and these are the steps on how it was done.  I have all the terminal output saved if anyone is interested in seeing, improving, or simplifying this method. 

This was done in virtualbox.  I installed the debian buster "testing" iso file (with firmwares) located at: … 64/iso-cd/
I then connected to this VM through ssh so that I could copy from and paste into a terminal window.  This was easier than using the vm window.
From this debian install, I made only the following changes:
- installed net-tools, to display ip address

apt install net-tools

- export PATH to /root/.bashrc by adding:

export PATH=/usr/local/sbin:/usr/local/bin:/usr/sbin:/usr/bin:/sbin:/bin

I then started the migration to devuan:
- changed sources.list to devuan, left only the one beowulf main entry
- installed devuan-keyring with

dpkg -i devuan-keyring_2017.10.03

- then ran these commands:

apt update
apt upgrade
apt install eudev
apt -f install
apt install sysvinit
apt dist-upgrade

-altered /etc/network/interfaces file
change these two lines from,

allow-hotplug enp0s3
iface enp0s3 inet dhcp


auto eth0
iface eth0 inet dhcp

-then updated grub to change Debian to Devuan


- purge systemd with

apt remove systemd --purge
apt remove libnss-systemd --purge

apt install libelogind0

to see that all is well.


Finally, the command

dpkg -l | grep systemd

produces no output.  No systemd here!! 

I distinctly remember reading three or four years ago that the ability to migrate from a debian to devuan install may not be possible in the future.  I don't think that day is here, yet.

#19 Re: Hardware & System Configuration » [SOLVED] how to go downrev with opera » 2019-04-09 17:30:19

Can I revert to Devuan's previous version?

I don't think that there is/was a "Devuan" version, because it is not supported in debian. 
How did you install it?  Was it with the repo mentioned here: ?

I would suggest to uninstall the "broken" version that you have and download and install the older version.  I am currently booted into ceres and I do not see it in the official repositories.

#20 Other Issues » Repositories accessible with ipv6 only? » 2019-03-19 22:20:46

Replies: 0

I was tinkering with a vps today and was configuring it for ipv6 only, with no ipv4 connectivity.  I tested the network connection and it appears to be working fine.  I can access it with ssh, and from the ssh session, I can ping an ipv6 site by using the domain name, so the dns resolver is working.  I then tried to do an "apt update" and I got many errors such as:

Cannot initiate the connection to ( - connect (101: Network is unreachable)

Naturally the repositories are online and working fine.  Does the devuan repository system have ipv6 capability?  If so, is there anything different to be done to access it?

#21 Re: Documentation » Tips for successfully migrating Ascii DE to Beowulf as of 11-08-2018 » 2019-03-17 15:38:48

Created /etc/apt/preferences.d/avoid_some_beo like fsmithred did.

It is my understanding that you do not need this any more.  You might want to try to remove it and see what wants to get updated.  Also, if you have them, you may be able to remove all references to ascii from sources.list .  I have done this to a couple of beowulf installs and it has caused no problems.  However, I do have one beowulf install where I still have ascii references in sources.list file so that I can use the ascii version of network-manager and its openvpn tools.

From what I have read and experienced, there have been at least two major improvements recently that makes beowulf closer to a beta state - first, the polkits got a major facelift a few weeks ago which have been applied with your dist-upgrade to beowulf, and second, you can run

apt install libelogind0

and this will make a noticable change to your system.

And may I add that the change produced with libelogind0 was very nice to see... (-;

#22 Re: Off-topic » Old Dell optiplex 780 sff died » 2019-03-06 13:39:40

Dual Core 3.2GHz... 4GB DDR4 (1x4GB)

Do you like to play with virtual machines?  For me, this is a little light on resources.  But then I don't know how close you want to stick with the $475 price you mentioned.
Will you be putting it together yourself?  If you are, then I would at least look at what Newegg has in the way of bundling.  Here are a couple of quick links for "DIY kits" that they currently have.  I saw one or two that were just under $700 and they came with a 6-core processor and more RAM. … tore/ID-33 … =BESTMATCH

I just last month purchased a kit and assembled myself.  It works great and am very pleased.  I do not like the cases that they are pushing now as it does not have any optical drives openings on the front.  I chose the Corsair 200R case and I really love it.

#23 Re: Hardware & System Configuration » ssd optimization on devuan » 2019-02-22 21:31:07

Any other suggestion for SSD optimization is appreciated

use a dedicated /var/ partition on an hdd

I have been setting up bind mounts today for a new system I purchased recently.  I have my notes right in front of me so a simple copy and paste will explain how I did this is ceres, beowulf, ascii, and another distribution. 
I prefer to use bind mounts instead of a separate partition because it reduces the number of partitions on a drive.  This method is pretty simple and quick.  It can also be used to create a bind mount folder for /tmp, if you wish.

- Create the folder that you want to bind to.  Example:

mkdir /mnt/Data/bind-mount-folder/var && /mnt/Data/bind-mount-folder/tmp

- chmod the newly created tmp folder to 0777:

chmod 0777 /mnt/Data/bind-mount-folder/tmp

- Copy contents of the /var folder to the place you designate:     

rsync -avzh /var/* /mnt/Data/bind-mount-folder/var && rsync -avzh /tmp/* /mnt/Data/bind-mount-folder/tmp

- Rename Original folders to save their contents.

mv /tmp /tmp.original && mv /var /var.original

- Create new folders to serve as mount points:

mkdir /tmp && mkdir /var

- Edit fstab with:

/mnt/Data/bind-mount-folder/var     /var		none	bind	0	0
/mnt/Data/bind-mount-folder/tmp     /tmp		none	bind	0	0

I suggest to be sure to put the bind entry in fstab below the mount entry for the destination location.  The second drive location (Data) must be mounted before the "bind mount" location.

- Mount the bind folders:

mount --bind /mnt/Data/bind-mount-folder/var /var && mount --bind /mnt/Data/bind-mount-folder/tmp /tmp

The nicest thing that I like about bind mounts is that the mounted folders and their contents will be included in backup functions like refractasnapshot. 


This just worked for two linux distributions, devuan and pclinuxos.  If this fails for any reason the system will not be bootable, as /var (and /tmp files) will need to be created.  Be sure that you have a live disk, or another boot method, to rename the original folder(s) and the system will be bootable again.

But like you mentioned, it may be less important today to reduce write functions on a newer solid state drive.

#24 Re: Devuan » A philosophical diatribe: How to avoid having users - and how not to » 2018-12-15 17:10:04

Greetings Mr. ESR,

I am another nobody just moving along at my own pace, and doing my own thing, especially with linux.  I too read your initial statement :

Sit up and pay attention...It was supposed to...

And got the same reaction as Miyo:

Good grief man.  Some of us don't know who you are...and telling us that we should respect you simply by declaring so is...well...

Well, it did not portray you as a humble or appreciative person.  Granted, a lot of times forum boards do not accurately portray someone.  Miscommunications are easy and do happen.  However, after reading your homepage, I think you are more humble and appreciative than you first appeared to be (within this forum board anyway).  I do disagree with your "personal shooting rig" though.  I prefer something different, wink    I thank you for your contributions to free software, and I thank you for your ideas presented in this thread.

I think all that is needed is a short write-up on the different installation medias available, and what will be installed by each.  Most of the content needed for this write up has already been presented within this thread.   This write-up could also be as a single Read Me text file placed with the downloadable files.  A short explanation of each media would be informative and this would help new users.

And thank you Devuan devs for all your efforts!  I like what you have done, and have enjoyed using your product for over 4 years!

#25 Re: Hardware & System Configuration » (solved) can't run sudo apt install » 2018-10-13 18:04:15

I don't see anything that is not correct, but I can state that at about the time that you were posting this, I was having some problems doing a regular update with similar "File not found" error messages. 

I would try it again later before I tried changing anything.

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