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#1 2018-04-04 11:14:47

miroR
Member
From: Zagreb, Croatia
Registered: 2016-11-30
Posts: 195
Website

Legal on Pale Moon potential packaging and distribution

I have put up a repo with one binary-amd64 package and one set of source: palemoon :

https://www.croatiafidelis.hr/foss/dev1miro/

It's provisional really at this time, but it's working.

I presented it at:
A repo serving Pale Moon
https://dev1galaxy.org/viewtopic.php?id=1972

With time, not yet, I might become knowledgeable enough to package Palemoon for Devuan... I might...

And I'd like to figure out about these legalities first. There is a fragment of a discussion over right after:

Palemoon installation from source
https://dev1galaxy.org/viewtopic.php?id=616#p8206

but I am moving my reply to here, because it is an issue that deserves a separate topic.

I'm not very good at legal issues at all, and the time to figure out all the parts of the licenses and read all the relevant discussions is adding to the hardship of it...

And advice is welcome... Do express your thoughts, it might help for the future. Pale Moon seems to me a really good browser, and maybe the licensing is eventually acceptable...

Also, pls look up my mozconfig that I used. You can easily download the sources (at least currently) from my:

https://www.croatiafidelis.hr/foss/dev1miro/

(even the less advanced in compilation) by reading the above linked "A repo serving Pale Moon" topic.

Is that mozconfig legal, as I think (for which read the next post in this topic)?

Last edited by miroR (2018-04-04 11:28:47)


Devs/testers/users of FOSS, what might be ahead for GNU/Linux after we lost PaX Team and spender? spender wrote:
https://forums.grsecurity.net/viewtopic … 699#p17127
Google made the choice to engage in underhanded competition against us with our own code...
grsecurity ripoff by Google, w/ Linus approval https://lists.dyne.org/lurker/message/2 … 4b.en.html

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#2 2018-04-04 11:19:43

miroR
Member
From: Zagreb, Croatia
Registered: 2016-11-30
Posts: 195
Website

Re: Legal on Pale Moon potential packaging and distribution

So this is the reply to this post:

Palemoon installation from source
https://dev1galaxy.org/viewtopic.php?id=616#p8206

moved here because it isn't to do with just compilation for a single person which that topic is about.
---

chillfan wrote:

Nice posts but I should point to this though (for your own benefit) which recently came up on the maling list.

https://github.com/jasperla/openbsd-wip/issues/86

I wasn't aware of that... Studying it carefully... However, I was compiling my Pale Moon since I started that topic:
Building Pale Moon on Devuan fails
https://forum.palemoon.org/viewtopic.php?f=57&t=15751
which is Fri, 07 Jul 2017, 19:03 and this is the first time somebody draws my attention to this...

A quick idea (to get free from the need to peruse that notification ): would it suffice that I remove the

export MOZILLA_OFFICIAL=1

or stick:

export MOZILLA_OFFICIAL=0

and what are the implications thereof?

But wait... See (if you or other gentle reader download the source as I explained how it can be done in my previous post):

$ grep with-system palemoon-27.8.3~repack/debian/mozconfig 
$

it's empty string. None! I don't have any --with-system-<whatever>! So I'd hope my Pale Moon repo is legit.

Do correct me if I'm wrong!

So, no for this (but do correct me if I'm wrong):

It would seem it's best to rebrand or disable branding when packaging, especially if you want to make changes to the build process.

and the changes that I made are not to do with anything --with-system-<whatever> options.

Also, I notice you mentioned grsecurity (the unofficial forward ports I guess). When I last looked they can't yet integrate meltdown/kpti, is much different there now?

Yeah, that's a thorny issue... No genius to help out there... Or the good few who are willing have not come to their full potential yet... Sad as can be... But that's a separate issue... If you want to discuss it more (just in case), pls. let's move to some of the grsec topic (of mine already on the forums, or create a new one if you prefer... Only saying, there's not much news there...)

Back to the licensing issue now.

I read more carefully on the OpenBSD attempt to package Pale Moon and the near "cease and decease" discussion as one of the BSD guys called it... Wow!... Hard stuff too... And sad, this issue is, too...

Dunno...

But thanks! (And do correct me if I'm wrong!)

Last edited by miroR (2018-04-04 11:22:30)


Devs/testers/users of FOSS, what might be ahead for GNU/Linux after we lost PaX Team and spender? spender wrote:
https://forums.grsecurity.net/viewtopic … 699#p17127
Google made the choice to engage in underhanded competition against us with our own code...
grsecurity ripoff by Google, w/ Linus approval https://lists.dyne.org/lurker/message/2 … 4b.en.html

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#3 2018-04-04 11:32:14

miroR
Member
From: Zagreb, Croatia
Registered: 2016-11-30
Posts: 195
Website

Re: Legal on Pale Moon potential packaging and distribution

Is my mozconfig legal?

From publicly available sources at:

https://www.croatiafidelis.hr/foss/dev1miro/

/some/where/$ cat  palemoon-27.8.3~repack/debian/mozconfig 
export MOZILLA_OFFICIAL=1
export CC=gcc-4.9
export CXX=g++-4.9
mk_add_options MOZ_CO_PROJECT=browser
ac_add_options --enable-official-branding
ac_add_options --enable-application=browser
ac_add_options --enable-release
ac_add_options --disable-installer
ac_add_options --disable-updater
ac_add_options --enable-optimize="-O2 -msse2 -mfpmath=sse"
ac_add_options --disable-debug
ac_add_options --with-pthreads
ac_add_options --enable-shared-js
ac_add_options --enable-jemalloc
ac_add_options --enable-strip
ac_add_options --x-libraries=/usr/lib
ac_add_options --prefix=/usr
ac_add_options --enable-devtools
ac_add_options --disable-necko-wifi
ac_add_options --disable-gstreamer
ac_add_options --with-pthreads
ac_add_options --disable-precompiled-startupcache
ac_add_options --disable-accessibility
ac_add_options --disable-b2g
ac_add_options --disable-dbus
ac_add_options --disable-gamepad
ac_add_options --disable-omx-plugin
ac_add_options --disable-parental-controls
ac_add_options --disable-profiling
ac_add_options --disable-pulseaudio
ac_add_options --disable-safe-browsing
ac_add_options --disable-telemetry
ac_add_options --disable-webrtc
ac_add_options --disable-webspeech
ac_add_options --enable-alsa
ac_add_options --enable-ffmpeg
ac_add_options --enable-fmp4
ac_add_options --enable-freetype
ac_add_options --enable-gnu-ld
ac_add_options --enable-install-strip
ac_add_options --enable-jemalloc
ac_add_options --enable-jemalloc-lib
ac_add_options --enable-libjpeg-turbo
ac_add_options --enable-multithread
ac_add_options --enable-ogg
ac_add_options --enable-optimize
ac_add_options --enable-opus
ac_add_options --enable-png
ac_add_options --enable-pthreads
ac_add_options --enable-raw
ac_add_options --enable-shared-js
ac_add_options --enable-strip
ac_add_options --enable-svg
ac_add_options --enable-threads
ac_add_options --enable-threadsafe
ac_add_options --enable-wave
ac_add_options --enable-webgl
ac_add_options --enable-webm
/some/where/$ 

Last edited by miroR (2018-04-04 11:32:47)


Devs/testers/users of FOSS, what might be ahead for GNU/Linux after we lost PaX Team and spender? spender wrote:
https://forums.grsecurity.net/viewtopic … 699#p17127
Google made the choice to engage in underhanded competition against us with our own code...
grsecurity ripoff by Google, w/ Linus approval https://lists.dyne.org/lurker/message/2 … 4b.en.html

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#4 2018-04-04 12:28:03

miroR
Member
From: Zagreb, Croatia
Registered: 2016-11-30
Posts: 195
Website

Re: Legal on Pale Moon potential packaging and distribution

I also asked at:
A Pale Moon repo for Devuan/Debian
https://forum.palemoon.org/viewtopic.ph … 22#p138422
I hope this can be worked out. This is a browser that does not impose pulseaudio nor dbus, is fast, and they don't seem to work behind people's back with intrusional purposes.


Devs/testers/users of FOSS, what might be ahead for GNU/Linux after we lost PaX Team and spender? spender wrote:
https://forums.grsecurity.net/viewtopic … 699#p17127
Google made the choice to engage in underhanded competition against us with our own code...
grsecurity ripoff by Google, w/ Linus approval https://lists.dyne.org/lurker/message/2 … 4b.en.html

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#5 2018-04-04 14:19:04

chillfan
Member
Registered: 2016-12-01
Posts: 52

Re: Legal on Pale Moon potential packaging and distribution

I'm not an expert but I think this would do it:

Change --enable-official-branding to --disable-official-branding and rename your package in debian/control to whatever name you like. I think so long as you don't use their artwork and don't call it palemoon you should be fine.

lf I remember the browser will call itself "New Moon" by default. That would seem ok in the meantime, but you'd want to rename eventually I think.

Otherwise just use the mozconfig they provide, but it will limit you to the defaults.

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#6 2018-04-04 14:33:13

miroR
Member
From: Zagreb, Croatia
Registered: 2016-11-30
Posts: 195
Website

Re: Legal on Pale Moon potential packaging and distribution

chillfan wrote:

I'm not an expert but I think this would do it:

Change --enable-official-branding to --disable-official-branding and rename your package in debian/control to whatever name you like. I think so long as you don't use their artwork and don't call it palemoon you should be fine.

lf I remember the browser will call itself "New Moon" by default. That would seem ok in the meantime, but you'd want to rename eventually I think.

Otherwise just use the mozconfig they provide, but it will limit you to the defaults.

I see, but the better way is to try and get Moonchild and his friends confident of my packages and get them to allow the official branding to remain...

In case the few options that I'm pretty unwilling to change, and they're not so many, get a PASS from New Tobin Paradigm, see:

A Pale Moon repo for Devuan/Debian
https://forum.palemoon.org/viewtopic.ph … 38#p138438

which I hope they will, I am motivated to work more. Else... time wasted...

As far as changing the licence: The Iceweasel story is a sad example. It lost support completely (IIRC) from Mozilla.

And you don't get geniuses available for some core issues in any complex project just so easily (remember how the https://github.com/minipli/linux-unofficial_grsec/ still hasn't moved passed the specter/meltdown mitigations, geniuses to solve it missing or, being late to do it; if only it is the latter...). Some things about really complex projects, there's only a few people in the world who are able to do it (well, in real time, I mean)...

The support by Moonchild and his team is very close to indispensable. (Especially because we are not huge as Debian.)

I'm on edges. Reloaded that Pale Moon link above a few times only while writing here...

Last edited by miroR (2018-04-04 14:37:13)


Devs/testers/users of FOSS, what might be ahead for GNU/Linux after we lost PaX Team and spender? spender wrote:
https://forums.grsecurity.net/viewtopic … 699#p17127
Google made the choice to engage in underhanded competition against us with our own code...
grsecurity ripoff by Google, w/ Linus approval https://lists.dyne.org/lurker/message/2 … 4b.en.html

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#7 2018-04-04 16:28:22

miroR
Member
From: Zagreb, Croatia
Registered: 2016-11-30
Posts: 195
Website

Re: Legal on Pale Moon potential packaging and distribution

It's Wed  4 Apr 16:26:28 UTC 2018 UTC...
No replies on https://forum.palemoon.org/viewtopic.ph … 50#p138438
And maybe nothing untill morning comes to the U.S. if they went to sleep. Hours of uneasy waiting...

EDIT: I can't believe I calculated as if the Earth revolved the opposite direction around the Sun than it does... It wasn't night, but it was morning or even early morning in the U.S. when I posted that question about mozconfig... (BTW, I can do complex things, but I sometimes fail on binary stuff, or completely simple stuff, such as I failed my driving exam 42 yrs ago on driving backwards smile ...Aarrgh!...)

IOW, it's full daytime still in the U.S, while night is drawing over Europe where I live... Just why not answer... How can I compile if I don't know I can at least get some of the options to the liking of a good part (and to no detriment to others) of Devuan users?

I'm not going to be compiling a dbus- nor pulseaudio- Pale Moon... They hopefully will support those options...

Last edited by miroR (2018-04-04 18:01:28)


Devs/testers/users of FOSS, what might be ahead for GNU/Linux after we lost PaX Team and spender? spender wrote:
https://forums.grsecurity.net/viewtopic … 699#p17127
Google made the choice to engage in underhanded competition against us with our own code...
grsecurity ripoff by Google, w/ Linus approval https://lists.dyne.org/lurker/message/2 … 4b.en.html

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