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#2 Re: Desktop and Multimedia » MATE 1.20 on devuan ascii » 2018-06-15 22:43:04

golinux wrote:

@colby . . . you should not have any packages installed directly from the Debian repos.  Doing so could really break your your system.  Packages from the Debian repos are pulled by amprolla via a redirect that filters out incompatible packages.

The following network-manager packages are available in the ascii repos:

https://pkginfo.devuan.org/cgi-bin/d1pk … ease=ascii

The mate packages, unless they are very new, should also be available on the Devuan repos.  I let you do your own searching.

@golinux

Hi.

For the THIRD time I am going to post to this thread the sources.list of the repositories I have used which produced a working mate 1.20 desktop COMPLETE with a working Mate power-manager and Mate network manager on Devuan 2.0 installed via netinst.

My Devuan 2.0-Release installation did not include the default Devuan desktop. It did include the Mate desktop component of Devuan 2.0-Release.

Here are some details so you have a complete picture of where I started from and the steps I took to get mate 1.20 with working mate-power-manager and network-manager (nm-applet) on my system.

After that installation I proceeded to reconfigure the desktop to have a single panel and a new desktop background. I compiled and installed a new theme - Vimix, available at the GIT. I added two sets of icons I have used since the release of the gtk2-version of the desktop. I tested to see if Caja would use some of these icons correctly to represent files and directories. It did not, as is usual since the switch to GTK3. These icons rendered correctly on Devuan1. I installed a freetype.sh and libreoffice.sh file in /etc/profile.d to ensure font rendering that I prefer and altered the /etc/fonts.d by removing various hints scripts to ensure Firefox rendered text as I prefer. I used dconf-editor to make various additional changes.

At the end of this I had a desktop that was similar to the desktop I used when gtk1 was the desktop toolkit and almost exactly like the desktop configuration I had when the desktop used the gtk2 toolkit. The theme I used then was entirely different and I miss it enough to from time to time consider returning to devuan-1.

The default mate desktop version included with Devuan-2 has various annoying cosmetic bugs which only seem to be completely fixed in mate 1.20.2. This has also been true on the mate release on  Manjaro and Ubuntu. This is not specific to the Devuan-2 release but to the Mate-desktop.

These bugs are greatly reduced in mate 1.20 on Manjaro, Ubuntu and Devuan-2.

I decided to try to upgrade mate to version 1.20 again. Unlike my prior attempts to upgrade to mate 1.20 using the Devuan-2 release candidate, this time, using Devuan-2-Release, the upgrade was completely uneventful.

This is what my sources.list contained before I upgraded to mate 1.20. It has not been changed since that upgrade.

# deb cdrom:[devuan_ascii_2.0.0_amd64_netinst]/ ascii main non-free

# deb cdrom:[devuan_ascii_2.0.0_amd64_netinst]/ ascii main non-free

deb http://pkgmaster.devuan.org/merged/ ascii main non-free contrib
deb-src http://pkgmaster.devuan.org/merged/ ascii main non-free contrib

deb http://pkgmaster.devuan.org/merged/ ascii-security main non-free contrib
deb-src http://pkgmaster.devuan.org/merged/ ascii-security main non-free contrib

deb http://pkgmaster.devuan.org/merged/ ascii-updates main non-free contrib
deb-src http://pkgmaster.devuan.org/merged/ ascii-updates main non-free contrib

deb http://pkgmaster.devuan.org/merged/ ascii-backports main non-free contrib

deb http://www.hezeh.org/packages/ ascii main contrib non-free
deb-src http://www.hezeh.org/packages/ ascii main contrib non-free


You have stated that I should not use debian packages because ...

If there are any debian repositories in my sources.list please point them out to me so I can remove them.

After the upgrade to mate 1.20, I removed wicd and xfce-power-manager from my system and replaced them with the following packages which all have origins in DEVUAN and HEZEH repositories.

gnome-power-manager                     3.22.2-2
mate-power-manager                        1.20.0-1+hezeh1
mate-power-manager-common         1.20.0-1+hezeh1

network-manager                              1.6.2-3+devuan1.1
network-manager-gnome                  1.4.4-1

Here are the origins for all of the packages listed above.

apt-cache policy gnome-power-manager
gnome-power-manager:
  Installed: 3.22.2-2
  Candidate: 3.22.2-2
  Version table:
*** 3.22.2-2 500
        500 http://pkgmaster.devuan.org/merged ascii/main amd64 Packages
        100 /var/lib/dpkg/status

apt-cache policy mate-power-manager
mate-power-manager:
  Installed: 1.20.0-1+hezeh1
  Candidate: 1.20.0-1+hezeh1
  Version table:
*** 1.20.0-1+hezeh1 500
        500 http://www.hezeh.org/packages ascii/main amd64 Packages
        100 /var/lib/dpkg/status

mate-power-manager-common:
  Installed: 1.20.0-1+hezeh1
  Candidate: 1.20.0-1+hezeh1
  Version table:
*** 1.20.0-1+hezeh1 500
        500 http://www.hezeh.org/packages ascii/main amd64 Packages
        100 /var/lib/dpkg/status
     1.16.2-1+deb9u1 500
        500 http://pkgmaster.devuan.org/merged ascii/main amd64 Packages

apt-cache policy network-manager
network-manager:
  Installed: 1.6.2-3+devuan1.1
  Candidate: 1.6.2-3+devuan1.1
  Version table:
*** 1.6.2-3+devuan1.1 500
        500 http://pkgmaster.devuan.org/merged ascii/main amd64 Packages
        100 /var/lib/dpkg/status

apt-cache policy network-manager-gnome
network-manager-gnome:
  Installed: 1.4.4-1
  Candidate: 1.4.4-1
  Version table:
*** 1.4.4-1 500
        500 http://pkgmaster.devuan.org/merged ascii/main amd64 Packages
        100 /var/lib/dpkg/status

Please show me the DEBIAN repository in the above list. I will be happy to remove the package.

Of course maybe that's not the problem. So to continue.

MSI asked/stated:

So, mate-power-manager here is a third-party package that has apparently been rebuilt so it won't depend on systemd and network-manager is a genuine Devuan package that has been forked from Debian in order to eliminate the systemd dependency.

My response to that was:

I have not looked at the source code or queried the maintainers for these packages, therefore I can not give you an authoritative answer to your question.

Though I have been programming since 1966, I have found that does not give me supernatural insight into other peoples code. Also, not everybody who uses a system like Devuan is a programmer.

The question is appropriate, asking for a clarification I can not give because I do not and have not worked with the code. If MSI is a programmer then all he need do is look at the code, or the change log for the package, but if he is not, or if the code base is large, then what.

He could send the same question to the package MAINTAINER and see if he gets an answer.


In particular.

dpkg-query -W -f='${Maintainer}' gnome-power-manager
Debian GNOME Maintainers <pkg-gnome-maintainers@lists.alioth.debian.org>

dpkg-query -W -f='${Maintainer}' mate-power-manager
Antonio Volpicelli <nioanto@live.it>

dpkg-query -W -f='${Maintainer}' power-manager-common
dpkg-query: no packages found matching power-manager-common

dpkg-query -W -f='${Maintainer}' network-manager
Vincenzo (KatolaZ) Nicosia <katolaz@freaknet.org>

dpkg-query -W -f='${Maintainer}' network-manager-gnome
Utopia Maintenance Team <pkg-utopia-maintainers@lists.alioth.debian.org>

This is a start in contacting people familiar with the code who can give MSI an authoritative answer to his question.

That's the best I could do in trying to answer his question.

You do understand that the packages these people maintain are all in DEVUAN or HEZEH repositories - right?

So getting back to those DEBIAN packages and repositories..

How bout you educating me about where those DEBIAN repositories are in my sources.list and what are the packages I'm using that are from DEBIAN.

#3 Re: Desktop and Multimedia » MATE 1.20 on devuan ascii » 2018-06-14 22:33:39

msi wrote:
colby wrote:

Both power manager and network manger run on devuan Mate-1.20. I installed them from devuan repositories and hezeh, as listed in my source.list file which follows.

[...]

These are the packages I have installed and running on my system:

gnome-power-manager                       3.22.2-2
mate-power-manager                          1.20.0-1+hezeh1
mate-power-manager-common           1.20.0-1+hezeh1

network-manager                                1.6.2-3+devuan1.1
network-manager-gnome                    1.4.4-1

So, mate-power-manager here is a third-party package that has apparently been rebuilt so it won't depend on systemd and network-manager is a genuine Devuan package that has been forked from Debian in order to eliminate the systemd dependency.

I have not looked at the source code or queried the maintainers for these packages, therefore I can not give you an authoratative answer to your question.

I think you can get authoritative answers from:

gnome-power-manager comes from  http://pkgmaster.devuan.org/pool/DEBIAN … .2-2_amd64. The Maintainers are Debian GNOME Maintainers <pkg-gnome-maintainers@lists.ailoth.debian.org>

network-manager-gnome comes from  http://pkgmaster.devuan.org/pool/DEBIAN … .4-1_amd64 The Maintainers are Utopia Maintenance Team <pkg-utopia-maintainers@lists.ailoth.debian.org>

mate-power-manager and mate-power-manager-common are from http://www.hezeh.org/pool/main/m/mate-p … zeh1_amd64 and  http://www.hezeh.org/pool/main/m/mate-p … hezeh1_all and are maintained by Antonio Volpicelli <nioanto@live.it>

I would read the source code or query the maintainers for an authoratative answer to your question.

A quick check of dependencies and recommended packages for these packages does not show systemd as a dependency or recommendation.

Mate-power-manager 1.20 breaks mate-power-manager <1.9.0.

#4 Re: Desktop and Multimedia » MATE 1.20 on devuan ascii » 2018-06-13 22:17:14

msi wrote:
colby wrote:

I've read that both mate-power-manager and mate-network-manager are dependent upon systemd.

Neither of those packages exist in Devuan. The latter doesn't even exist in Debian. AntoFox should be able to explain how network configuration and power management for MATE are being handled in Devuan.

colby wrote:

Systemd is not running on my system. There is an /etc/systemd directory with a few entries none of which concern mate-power-manager. There is some networking window dressing, but how these files are used without systemd is unclear to me. Systemd became a Gnome project dependency in 2011. All I know about systemd is I don't want to run on a system that is dependent on it.

I think you should read https://dev1galaxy.org/viewtopic.php?id=1925.

Hi

Both power manager and network manger run on devuan Mate-1.20. I installed them from devuan repositories and hezeh, as listed in my source.list file which follows.

I removed wicd and xfce-power-manager.

I'm not going to argue the merits of these applications, that's not really the issue. I customize my desktop and system as I choose. That's what was attractive about linux when it first came out; at least to me.

As to systemd, my only interest in it is whether it's running or not.

These are the packages I have installed and running on my system:

gnome-power-manager                       3.22.2-2
mate-power-manager                          1.20.0-1+hezeh1
mate-power-manager-common           1.20.0-1+hezeh1

network-manager                                1.6.2-3+devuan1.1
network-manager-gnome                    1.4.4-1

They can be found in:

======my repositories

# deb cdrom:[devuan_ascii_2.0.0_amd64_netinst]/ ascii main non-free

# deb cdrom:[devuan_ascii_2.0.0_amd64_netinst]/ ascii main non-free

deb http://pkgmaster.devuan.org/merged/ ascii main non-free contrib
deb-src http://pkgmaster.devuan.org/merged/ ascii main non-free contrib

deb http://pkgmaster.devuan.org/merged/ ascii-security main non-free contrib
deb-src http://pkgmaster.devuan.org/merged/ ascii-security main non-free contrib

deb http://pkgmaster.devuan.org/merged/ ascii-updates main non-free contrib
deb-src http://pkgmaster.devuan.org/merged/ ascii-updates main non-free contrib

deb http://pkgmaster.devuan.org/merged/ ascii-backports contrib non-free main 

deb http://www.hezeh.org/packages/ ascii main contrib non-free
deb-src http://www.hezeh.org/packages/ ascii main contrib non-free

#5 Re: Desktop and Multimedia » MATE 1.20 on devuan ascii » 2018-06-13 21:43:21

Hi,

When I looked for mate-screenshot, I couldn't find it. I used synaptic and found gnome-screenshot and installed that. However, my repository list may be different than yours. I'll include my repository list after this comment.

Installing gnome-screenshot installs just the package. No other dependencies are included in the download.

When I use  main menu ->accessories->screenshot, I sometimes get the same message you do with an additional comment to check the  mate-utils installation, but most of the time it just works.

I upgraded mate to 1.20  over the mate distribution included in devuan.

When I checked mate-utils, I found I have mate-utils from 1.16 and mate-utils-common from 1.20 installed.

I'm guessing that may have something to do with the problem, at least on my system.

If I issue a "gnome-screenshot --interactive" command, that seems to fix the problem, but not permanently. 

====== my repositories

# deb cdrom:[devuan_ascii_2.0.0_amd64_netinst]/ ascii main non-free

# deb cdrom:[devuan_ascii_2.0.0_amd64_netinst]/ ascii main non-free

deb http://pkgmaster.devuan.org/merged/ ascii main non-free contrib
deb-src http://pkgmaster.devuan.org/merged/ ascii main non-free contrib

deb http://pkgmaster.devuan.org/merged/ ascii-security main non-free contrib
deb-src http://pkgmaster.devuan.org/merged/ ascii-security main non-free contrib

deb http://pkgmaster.devuan.org/merged/ ascii-updates main non-free contrib
deb-src http://pkgmaster.devuan.org/merged/ ascii-updates main non-free contrib

deb http://pkgmaster.devuan.org/merged/ ascii-backports contrib non-free main 

deb http://www.hezeh.org/packages/ ascii main contrib non-free
deb-src http://www.hezeh.org/packages/ ascii main contrib non-free

#6 Re: Desktop and Multimedia » MATE 1.20 on devuan ascii » 2018-06-13 16:17:50

Hi,

I've read that both mate-power-manager and mate-network-manager are dependent upon systemd. This is a recent dependency for both applications as they were working for the Gnome2 desktop, from which mate was derived,  and if memory serves me both were present in the gnome 1 desktop based on gtk1. This was a very different animal under the hood and used Orbit, to provide the Gnu Network Object Model Environment,  as an object request broker, which was a GNU development, adopted by the Gnome project. The Gnome desktop was started and run by Miguel de Icaza and Federico Mena and many many volunteers, not the current crew at gnome.

Systemd is not running on my system. There is an /etc/systemd directory with a few entries none of which concern mate-power-manager. There is some networking window dressing, but how these files are used without systemd is unclear to me . Systemd became a Gnome project dependency in 2011. All I know about systemd is I don't want to run on a system that is dependent on it.

#7 Re: Desktop and Multimedia » MATE 1.20 on devuan ascii » 2018-05-13 17:06:29

UPDATE -

I installed Devuan 2.0 release a couple of days ago with the mate desktop. I used the iso-installer version to do the installation.

I just updated the Mate Desktop to Mate 1.20.

The update was uneventful.

It includes a working Mate Power-Manager and Mate NetworkManager.

Restarting after updating and setting up Power-manager as a startup progam, was uneventful and the notification area tray had the familiar icon set for NetworkManager and Power Manager.

My desktop is customized in numerous ways, including a theme called Vimix which I get from the git. The theme and all customizations render as expected.

This release, 1.20, performs and looks exactly as expected, however, if you were using wicd before installing network-manager there will probably be a problem with network-manager showing a device not ready status for wifi networks. This is easy to solve by sudo service stop wicd and sudo service restart network-manager. Removing wicd entirely using the command line or synaptics also works.

The only caveat I can pass on is if you plan to use or update to Mate 1.20, use  Devuan 2.0 release, not a release candidate, or you will probably experience what I did in my prior post which follows. I did not update from Jessie so I don't know how an update from Jessie to asciii and installation/update to 1.20 would work out.

=======================================================================

prior post begins here

=======================================================================

Hi,

I twice tried to install Mate 1.20 after setting up source.list as described on your site.

Both attempts were made against fresh installs of Devuan 2.0 RC.

I tried the installation once from the command line - lots of complaints - and once from synaptic, some complaints.

In both attempts I got to the point where the only package not installed was weather-something.

After I rebooted, the slim login turned up just as expected.

After pressing F1, Mate Session was displayed.

When I completed logging in, the slim screen disappeared and a blank purplish screen turned up, with Mate Session still displayed.

This was not the background I had chosen for Mate when I configured it, after the initial installation of Mate using synaptic from the default xfce deskkop..

After a few moments, a  wicd notification turned up telling me I was connected to a network .

That's all that happened, no matter how long I waited.

Hope this is useful.

As a comment:

Mate 1.20.1, which I used on Manjaro and Ubuntu on my laptop, fixed all the problems that had concerned me since the Mate switched to GTK3.

Mate 1.20  still had problems with the display of panel drawers that contained multiple items.

I

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