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#1 2020-04-17 13:57:00

Altoid
Member
Registered: 2017-05-07
Posts: 416  

[Solved] Devuan Raspbian images

Hello:

I'm currently waiting for delivery of a Raspberry Pi 3B+ to use with my coffee roasting setup.
In the meanwhile (lots of it) I'm reading up on what's going on with Raspberry/Raspbian and I came across this page on the official Raspberry Pi web site.

What called my attention, knowing there are Devuan Raspbian images available, was that their availability was not listed on the page under the Third Party Operating System Images section along with Ubuntu and others.

Is there a sound reason for that or is it because of the systemd thing? (spelt it right this time ...)

Thanks in advance,

A.

Last edited by Altoid (2020-04-23 13:12:44)

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#2 2020-04-21 13:58:41

Altoid
Member
Registered: 2017-05-07
Posts: 416  

Re: [Solved] Devuan Raspbian images

Hello:

Seems it was not a very interesting topic for anyone here.
But I am convinced that systemd must go.

So I thought it would be useful to post at the Raspberry Pi forum and see what was up.

DougieLawson wrote:

It's not supported on here. The OS on here is Raspbian complete with the full-fat systemd wonderfulness. I'd guess that 99.999% of folks on the forum a) won't know what Devuan is, b) won't know why they'd swap from Raspbian and c) have no problems with systemd (and any quirks it may possess).

Solved.
There does not seem to be much love for systemd free OSs at raspberrypi.org, seems they deem it to be innocuous.

Cheers,

A.

Last edited by Altoid (2020-04-21 14:01:56)

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#3 2020-04-21 14:39:11

xinomilo
Member
Registered: 2017-07-02
Posts: 118  

Re: [Solved] Devuan Raspbian images

there should be more reasons to go systemd-free,... rpi and other arm devices run much faster / less RAM usage, without it.

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#4 2020-04-21 15:25:13

Altoid
Member
Registered: 2017-05-07
Posts: 416  

Re: [Solved] Devuan Raspbian images

Hello:

xinomilo wrote:

there should be more reasons to go systemd-free,... rpi and other arm devices run much faster / less RAM usage, without it.

Should?
There are a great many more reasons to go systemd-free.
I confess that I was not aware of (but suspected) "... much faster / less RAM usage".

Evidently it is something the people/developers at raspberripi.org don't care about or just cannot be bothered with.
The answer I got to my post exudes the shortsighted pragmatism often seen in some forums on the web regarding systemd and I'm really at odds as to how to question it successfully.

But I cannot shake the suspicion that there could well be a dyed-in-the-wool pro systemd stance behind such pragmatism.

eg:
... It's not supported on here.
... (and any quirks it may possess) ... <--- any quirks?

Cheers,

A.

Last edited by Altoid (2020-04-21 15:26:57)

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#5 2020-04-21 15:51:06

xinomilo
Member
Registered: 2017-07-02
Posts: 118  

Re: [Solved] Devuan Raspbian images

should, yes.  in general, i try not to be a hater, but an init freedom lover ;-)
i don't mind people using systemd really... it's foss so i guess it's ok. at least rpi folks realise the "full-fat systemd ...ness" .... smile

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#6 2020-04-23 13:12:11

Altoid
Member
Registered: 2017-05-07
Posts: 416  

Re: [Solved] Devuan Raspbian images

Hello:

xinomilo wrote:

... not to be a hater, but an init freedom lover ...

This has absolutely nothing to do with hate.
Nor is there anything wrong with being an init freedom lover.

This as long as the society/ecosystem you move in and interact with (in this case, Debian and the Pottering crowd) is actually willing to accept that view.
ie: that of init freedom and (of course) in the context we are in: that of Devuan basically depending on Debian to exist.

But pray tell me ...

Just what are you going to love when init freedom ends up becoming systemd dependency?
What will you do then with all your init freedom love?

I imagine that you think this is a far fetched idea and that no, that will never happen.
How sure are you?

You probably missed this this thread.
And if you did not, you surely missed the significance of what it is reporting.

It is my opinion (YMMV) that Pottering and those who follow him in Debian are firmly set on making systemd the init standard for the distribution.
And when this happens Devuan, save a real miracle, will vanish.

xinomilo wrote:

... rpi folks realise the "full-fat systemd ...ness" ...

It is quite obvious that you missed the poster's sly sarcasm.

I fear that this laissez faire approach to systemd will end up being the demise of Devuan and everything based on it.

Cheers,

CIV

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#7 2020-04-23 13:51:52

xinomilo
Member
Registered: 2017-07-02
Posts: 118  

Re: [Solved] Devuan Raspbian images

your post is full of assumptions. just imagine this and that.. lots of fantasies to keep you occupied with systemd all/every day. tbh, i can't read another systemd related post anymore. it's not laissez-faire, it's just that people are obsessed with this crap (good or bad) for far too many years already, and can't move forward, or really discuss other inits (runit, s6, openrc, others) and init freedom in general. how are you keeping other options alive, when you only talk about systemd?
search the word "systemd" and the word "runit" in this forum. tell me how many posts you find mentioning each. that should be fun tongue

and oh well, there are other more important things in real life (like surviving...). what am i going to do with Devuan if i can't have food to eat?

and since you ask, concerning my poor ignorant me..., if i still have to work on linux when there's only systemd around, well i could do that for a salary, but then i probably wouldn't like my job for too long, and eventually quit it.
tbh, i've been thinking of gardening/farming as an alternative. it's very tempting already..

FYI, there's tens of nosystemd distros apart from devuan, lots of bsds, and hurd that could use some love too.

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#8 2020-04-30 18:51:23

tuxd3v
Member
Registered: 2019-11-14
Posts: 98  

Re: [Solved] Devuan Raspbian images

Altoid wrote:

Hello:

I'm currently waiting for delivery of a Raspberry Pi 3B+ to use with my coffee roasting setup.
In the meanwhile (lots of it) I'm reading up on what's going on with Raspberry/Raspbian and I came across this page on the official Raspberry Pi web site.

What called my attention, knowing there are Devuan Raspbian images available, was that their availability was not listed on the page under the Third Party Operating System Images section along with Ubuntu and others.

Is there a sound reason for that or is it because of the systemd thing? (spelt it right this time ...)

Thanks in advance,

A.

Hello Altoid,
Raspbian images is a thing from RaspberryPi Foundation..

Devuan has Devuan Images..
You can find rpi3 arm64 images for devuan for example  here ..

Also you can find a arm64 Image for RPi4 by MetaYan here( scroll to the last post by yan ) smile

Last edited by tuxd3v (2020-04-30 18:56:46)


Best Regards,
tux

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