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golinux wrote:Looks fine to me:
https://transfer.sh/iRrGh/coupon-test.pdfIt looks fine to me too. BTW, I am using "Document Viewer", which I believe is Evince.
Here's mine:
https://transfer.sh/Ui8xn/Firefox-print-to-PDF-test.pdf
Phil
Yeah, that looks pretty bad. I don't have a clue what the problem is.
You have to create an iso before you can burn it to DVD or dd to thumb drive. refractasnapshot from our very own fsmithred works very well but will require some RTFM. You can download it from the Devuan repos. Here's a link to the documentation:
https://refracta.org/documents.html
Traditionally there is a 4GB limit to an ISO file but alphalpha recently found a way to make an iso larger than that:
https://dev1galaxy.org/viewtopic.php?id=2416
I tried it on my current system but had to exclude almost all of my home directory to get it down to just over 5 GB. It boots and runs,
The companion to refractasnapshot is the refractainstaller which is what Devuan uses to install the desktop-live and minimal-live isos.
I'm wondering what pdf viewer he's using. I dumped evince years ago for atril (mate).
I printed the coupon in firefox quantum 64.0 as pdf and it appears ok (usable). I would post it here, but I dont see any way to attach/include a file in this forum?
Use transfer.sh It won't stay up for long but long enough for this purpose.
Looks fine to me:
https://transfer.sh/iRrGh/coupon-test.pdf
golinux wrote:
And desktop users are NOT our target audienceThis statement has me baffled. Do you mean desktop as in Desktop Environment, or as in desktop versus laptop?
Systemd is more of a threat to the stability of servers than the desktop and that is what prompted the VUAs (Veteran Unix Administrators) to fork Debian. They run clusters of servers that power the internet and businesses. Here's an early description of the fork by one of our VUA developers (which is a bit outdated because Devuan has evolved). This is the audience that Devuan was intended to target.
Other Devuan users are minimalists who tinker and do amazing things putting together elements in a very unique and creative way often for older hardware. These Devuan users may never see a Desktop Environment. So a full blown DE is irrelevant to them.
I do not fall into either category. I am a desktop user but like it my way which is neither Ubuntu nor Mint because they insult my intelligence and personal aesthetic.
Devuan ships with DEs because users have stepped up to unravel the systemd dependencies for the DE of their choice and do the theming. I am an Xfce user so theme it to my liking (and hopefully that of others).
Or probably better #devuan-www@freenode.
golinux i was only being sarcastic, that's it
.
i mean just majority of linux users care about candy desktop environment or out of the box experience as i said. author of the topic mentioned being devuan bigger than ubuntu.
i doubt it that lots of people care about things like init system or non bloated distribution.
Ah, OK. For most people a computer in any form is a device like a refrigerator or a microwave. They don't understand or care about the technology. Sadly, they only care about the appearance. Their collective ignorance is bringing much harm to our social fabric and governance but they are blind to that. Unfortunately, there is no cure for stupidity. And so we slide further down the rabbit hole . . .
I think all that is needed is a short write-up on the different installation medias available, and what will be installed by each. Most of the content needed for this write up has already been presented within this thread. This write-up could also be as a single Read Me text file placed with the downloadable files. A short explanation of each media would be informative and this would help new users.
Revisions to the website to further explain and clarify are in process.
There is something about devuan kernel being outdated, the newest is like 419 i think, as far as i remember devuan had 410.
Devuan is about STABILITY not cutting edge. Newer kernels are available from backports or you can build your own.
I noticed that in general linux users will choose bloated distro with great candy graphics rather than devuan xfce. If devuan team wants to be better than ubuntu, it should tweak a bit with xfce to make it look sweetier, so majority of ubuntu or gnome users will feel like yeah devuan xfce desktop looks much better than this fedora or ubuntu i have, lets hop to devuan
. Its like im gonna use this distro cuz it has cool desktop environment better than others.
We are not trying to be "better" than Ubuntu or any other distro. We offer an alternative. And desktop users are NOT our target audience and we are NOT trying to attract users who want shiny, shiny. As I said before . . . there was a time when we considered shipping Devuan as a core system without ANY desktop.
And also popular distros autodetect gpu drivers so majority of users will use distro that gives them steam and their nvidia gpu configured out of the box...
You just don't get that Devuan is not an OOTB experience (and neither is Debian). If you want that feature, use Ubuntu or Mint or better yet lobby to have an Ubuntu or Mint Devuan Edition. Please stop trying to turn us into something we aren't (and hopefully will never be).
golinux wrote:That is a non-sequitur. I think that something was lost in translation. Alsa is here to stay. apulse just allows apps to use alsa instead of pulseaudio where pulseaudio is a required dependency.
apulse is a tiny workaround, but it won't replace fully pulseaudio.
apulse is not intended to replace alsa. It is intended to allow alsa to be used without having to send it through pulseaudio. For example audio will not work in FF quantum without pulseaudio. But I just uninstalled pulseaudio. installed apulse and sound still works. It fools FF into thinking that pulseaudio is there.
You may try to use a LInux desktop like Gnome, XFCE,... without pulseaudio.
I happily use Xfce without pulseaudio.
Please try to relax and take it down a notch. There is no need for drama here . . . or for systemd and Poettering bashing. Time to move on.
golinux wrote:spartrekus wrote:If pulseaudio has such a not so good reputation, why not to rewrite another one, but better?
Why is an alternative needed at all? What's wrong with alsa? Though I've never tried, I understand that apulse can reinstate alsa functionality in applications that have a dependency on pulseaudio. Will need to figure that out when Quantum is unavoidable. There are notes in this forum and also on DNG.
Alsa is ok. Alsa cannot be avoided for graphical usage and multimedia from Linux kernel. Alsa takes crucial part in the kernel for audio.
That is a non-sequitur. I think that something was lost in translation. Alsa is here to stay. apulse just allows apps to use alsa instead of pulseaudio where pulseaudio is a required dependency.
@spartrekus . . . don't fall for the MX Linux systemd-free hype. Explained here:
If pulseaudio has such a not so good reputation, why not to rewrite another one, but better?
Why is an alternative needed at all? What's wrong with alsa? Though I've never tried, I understand that apulse can reinstate alsa functionality in applications that have a dependency on pulseaudio. Will need to figure that out when Quantum is unavoidable. There are notes in this forum and also on DNG.
It can be harmful and free. A trojan can be made with source code available + with GNU General Public License, Version 3. Then, it will enter the stable release.
Of course. But until you have hard evidence that this is happening please stop spreading FUD.
Whether pulseaudio is bad or not, it's a very different situation to systemd. The main difference is that it was written as *nix software rather than "Linux proprietary", like systemd. So it can be installed and run on e.g. the 'BSDs, Illumos, even macOS.
This description is misleading because systemd is not "proprietary" in the sense of black-box blob. It is also free software even though it's purpose is to deny freedom. It's a paradox but one which has allowed it to not be censored by the FSF.
@siva . . . I got the same result:
The following packages will be REMOVED:
avahi-daemon* libnss-mdns*@siva . . . You'd think a quick search would be the first thing to do. But is sooo much easier to let someone else do it.
We all have to start somewhere. But around this crowd if you're going to whine about something it's best to know and understand what you're whining about before making grandiose statements about your preferences.
I agree with spartrekus that pulseaudio is crap. I avoid anything made by its author.
The error is that he described pulseaudio as non-free software. No one dislikes pulseaudo more than I. But just as systemd is free software so is pulseaudio according to the license (if not the spirit). All his other complaints are also not true. So it is indeed "bullocks". There is no non-free software in the "main" repository. non-free has to be enabled in order to install proprietary blobs. Under certain circumstances, blobs are available if needed during the OS installation procedure.
about firefox, debian builds firefox with alsa by default ...
Yes, but Quantum now requires pulseaudio to use alsa. Supposedly apulse will substitute but I haven't tried it.
We live in personal and communal spaces. Imagine someone coming to one of those spaces and immediately wanting to rearrange the furniture. Maybe they think it will improve the feng shui or provide a better view of the lake or . . .
We all have reasons for our actions and most often it is to satisfy our personal preferences. Sometimes it's for what we consider the greater good (which of course could be a completely deluded conclusion). But that is little consolation to those living in that space who might not be so enthused about the disruption. This proves once again that human interactions are flawed and unreliable.
Overlaying emotional perceptions and interpretations and judgments on any "uncomfortable" situation never adds value to the conversation. It is in fact a hindrance to cooperation.
jaromil has said more than once that we welcome anyone to join us at the campfire if they come in peace. Those of us working on Devuan maintain a strong collaborative effort. It is never about any one of us. Even though we may not always agree, we share a commitment to the future Devuan. We are always exploring and learning how to do things better. We just want to move the furniture when we decide it's the right time and for the right reasons.
Oh . . . is that all? Looking forward to your patch.