09:01:00 <rrq> rwp: the design might have "fence", "database" and "detection" as separate concerns and modules

10:27:09 <rwp> There is clearly a lot of community desire and need for such a project!

15:08:42 <Afdal> Can anyone explain the arcane magicks of X11 power management

15:09:43 <Afdal> Sometimes it seems like when my system has been on for a while one of my screensaver/power manager controllers just decides that it's suddenly going to no longer respect my time-until-do-X settings

15:09:57 <Afdal> And I cannot figure out how the heck to get it back under control

15:10:17 <Afdal> Like right now for instance when I'm watching video in a web browser

15:10:44 <Afdal> sometimes that behavior I actually want (detect video playing and disable monitor control during it)

15:10:52 <Afdal> is what I get

15:10:57 <Afdal> and sometimes not

15:11:44 <Afdal> Right now it's not, and I can run to XScreenSaver or xfce4-power-manager and move sliders back and forth

15:11:56 <Afdal> and nothing works >:O

15:18:39 <Afdal> I just don't get it and it's mind-boggling to me how I'm still having problems with this

15:18:48 <Afdal> the same kind of problems that have been around over a decade ago

15:19:19 <Afdal> How hard is it to get screensaver/power control right >:/

15:43:33 <rwp> Afdal, I don't agree with this famed author but it provides some good background on screensavers regardless. https://www.jwz.org/blog/2020/12/xscreensaver-5-45/

15:45:02 <Afdal> blegh, systemd

15:45:56 <Afdal> hmmm is this a problem because browsers are trying to force systemd dependencies?

15:52:23 <rwp> Which browser are you trying to use to play videos when the screensaver is being invoked? I haven't had problems using Firefox and normal xset dpms settings.

15:53:57 <Afdal> Palemoon, but as I said this works fine for a while

15:54:08 <Afdal> and then sometimes something just poops itself

15:54:26 <Afdal> Is dpms the low-level controller for this stuff?

15:54:37 <Afdal> that sounds familiar

15:54:45 <Afdal> how do I check my current dpms settings...

15:57:24 <Afdal> Problem is even if I tick a box in xfce4-power-manager or whatever to "allow program to control DPMS instead of X11", it refuses to work!

15:57:52 <Afdal> I can't figure out which program or daemon or whatever is actually in control of display power >:/

17:23:51 <rwp> Afdal, Re: how do I check my current dpms settings... Use: xset q

17:24:17 <rwp> However I know nothing more about how to have xfce do or do not control this. I am using a simple window manager. i3 in my case.

20:08:18 <talismanick> How's Devuan + runit for practical use?

20:08:48 <talismanick> (want Debian stability and practicality, but like runit more than systemd)

20:10:20 <gnarface> it's practical but missing some startup files for some services

20:10:31 <gnarface> sysvinit is still better supported

20:10:46 <gnarface> but if you know what you're doing it should work fine

20:11:00 <talismanick> gnarface: Any amenities I'll likely miss? Most runit scripts are pretty short anyways

20:11:22 <gnarface> i can't say from firsthand experience, but if you hang out here long enough you should be able to talk to someone who has tried it

20:13:28 <gnarface> from what i recall it's just that the runit scripts themselves aren't fully populated

20:13:43 <gnarface> so you might have to make a few or dig them out of archives, depending on which daemons you're using

20:14:03 <gnarface> to some degree that's a problem with sysvinit too just to much lesser of a degree

21:26:31 <deuxexmachina> is devuan as reproducible as debian? I don't see why it wouldn't but figured I'd ask

21:27:02 <onefang> Devuan mostly uses Debian packages.

21:29:08 <onefang> Which means Devuan is mostly as reproducible as Debian.

21:31:19 <deuxexmachina> For just running docker containers on bare metal I don't see a need for systemd, but still curious about TalosOS since it is supposedly tailored for k8s

01:29:20 <ibanja> regex question (anyone good with regex?):

01:29:21 <ibanja> I need to remove a substring from within a string. The substring could be one of two possibilities... either "Trade: Long" or "Trade: Short". Example that didn't work:

01:29:21 <ibanja> echo "Trade: Long some security name (EXCHANGE:SYMBOL)" |sed 's/Trade: (Short|Long)//'

01:30:58 <fluffywolf> you need sed -r if you want to do complex regexs

01:31:51 <ibanja> ok... that worked. Thanks!

01:32:29 <fluffywolf> glad to help!

01:45:11 <_ds_> -r or some backslashes.

02:17:03 <phogg> sed -E should be preferred over sed -r (ERE mode for sed has been standardized to -E, matching grep)

02:25:30 <lts> Next you say we should start using ss instead of netstat

02:35:37 <phogg> netstat vs. ss is a rather different issue, using -E instead of -r is a drop-in replacement

03:05:08 <rwp> netstat and ss interface to the Linux kernel, which is always in motion and so must chase it. sed operates purely in userland space.

07:59:30 <FatPhil> ibanja: to be honest, if I'm resorting to actual scripting, rather than just a one-liner, I'd just hit perl. I should remember the -E switch to sed, I basically just remember to backslash everything that doesn't normally need backslashes to get sed to work, but I hate ugly commandlines.

08:01:30 <FatPhil> I did have a good workmate who liked to take my perl scripts and then convert them to sh+sed+grep+... in order to prove to me that perl wasn't necessary. Of course, he was right, but was it worth the effort? Of course it was, because programming's art as well as science.

08:56:10 <Juest> um, i have a really old install and i forgot the password and usernames in place