previous
2019-04-02
11:28:55 <Digit> got my firefox held at an older version to keep using the policeman addon (not willing to be forced to ublock or whatever alternative). faaaar from ideal. itching to find other again. got a midori i sometimes use, and wonder/dream about imbuing it with that policeman/ublock alike features. uzbl also on my radar, but when browsing, often want something lazy-clicky not needing exotic keybinds for everything.
11:35:08 <plasma41> Digit, I've been eyeing Waterfox as a candidate for my next web browser.
11:45:34 * Digit does an apt-get update and apt-get install waterfox, to be greeted with "E: Unable to locate package waterfox", ending his lazy poke of trying it.
14:56:14 <xrogaan> that mike individual is slowly starting to get on my nerves.
15:06:37 <Jookia> devuan doesn't have ARM installers, only images?
15:54:38 <Wonka> xrogaan: that Lennart individual is still worse :p
20:18:27 <cosurgi> Question: was that a hack or a stupid april fools joke?
20:23:13 <debdog> neither
20:25:42 <hightower2> cosurgi, a very inappropriate april fools joke
20:40:23 <MinceR> s/inappropriate/funny/
21:14:55 <hightower3> MinceR, while I don't agree at all with overly lengthy discussions about it on the mailing list and everywhere, the inability to reach a general agreement that this "joke" was terrible and should never happen again is genuinely disturbing.
21:15:24 <MinceR> it disturbes those who believe that it was terrible and should never happen again, though
21:15:39 <MinceR> then again, it would be pointless to make the same joke again, so i guess i agree with that part
21:15:45 <MinceR> s/bes/bs/
21:17:03 <xinomilo> the inability to reach a general agreement that this "joke" was funny and should happen again is genuinely disturbing.
21:18:11 <xinomilo> we're all right, let it go and move on with something serious
21:18:45 <hightower3> by 'never again' I meant to include everything that would be similar as well. One of serious problems with this "joke" was that I was reading about it in the morning/noon hours of Mar 31st (i.e. not April 1). Also, some people tried to explain that if anyone visited devuan.org they could see that there was no actual javascript in the page and that it was a joke. However, I didn't visit devuan.org because I have no business visiting sup
21:18:45 <hightower3> posedly compromised websites. Also, I came here to check if the incident was genuine, only to see people from the Devuan team acting legitimately concerned. And finally, it caused me great unrest thinking about which systems did I have with "automatic updates" enabled.
21:19:12 <MinceR> well, the timing was a bit off
21:19:30 <MinceR> still, it became clear to me pretty quickly that it was april fools
21:20:14 <MinceR> not only because of the timing but because gopher is something devuan's enemies wouldn't like and the gopherhole had too much content
21:21:24 <hightower3> I didn't go to visit any of the (supposedly) compromised content. The only clue I had about this being a joke is that last month I visited parazyd's website and there he had a sentence like (paraphrasing) "stop using obsolete protocol http. Switch to gopher".
21:23:57 <hightower3> a much more appropriate/harmless joke would have been a note about e.g. devuan switching to systemd. Or if that one would have been too obvious, they could have made a joke about e.g. Microsoft striking a deal to employ all key devuan developers, or that Microsoft wants to create a Linux distribution based on Devuan, or something of that nature...
21:24:39 <MinceR> those are probably all too obvious and worn out
21:25:08 <hightower3> well... with all the effort and persistence in the security incident joke, they sure could have figured something else too
21:38:40 <MinceR> and you would complain about that too
21:40:51 <Wonka> I thought this was a nice April Fool's Joke.
21:42:02 <Wonka> well, no, I still think it was a good joke.
22:04:15 <xrogaan> It's not about the joke not being funny, it's about the joke being too serious.
22:04:37 <xrogaan> Ah ah, I get it, a fack pwned page. Great. Can I work now?
22:05:07 <xrogaan> work or find information or whatever.
22:06:58 <xrogaan> switching to systemd is too obvious for a April 1st. Would have been better to announce that Xorg would be deprecated in favor of devuan's own fork of wayland.
22:07:59 <xrogaan> And claim that it will revolutionize the linux world by bringing much needed changes.
---------- 2019-04-03 ----------
00:26:41 <msiism> a while back i noticed a strange behavior of pmount when using tab auto-completion on the device name, namely that it would hang when you hit the tab key and require you to hit ctrl+c zu "unhang" it in order to type the rest of the device name.
00:27:12 <msiism> when i mentioned this in a discussion about pmount in this channel, no one seemed to have seen the problem and i wasn't able to reproduce it. however, it just happened again. so, there is some problem, obviously.
00:28:49 <msiism> to be more specific: the device i'm trying to mount is /dev/sdb1, when if type `pmount /de` and hit tab, it will hang. the same goes for hitting tab after `pmount /dev`.
00:30:12 <gnarface> msiism: completely normal. if the possible completions in their pretty simple algorithm exceed what is in the filesystem cache, it has to go back to read the hardrive to refresh the cache. if there's a lot of possible completions, you will notice some delay
00:30:35 <gnarface> you can customize the auto-completion behavior in bash but i've never really messed much with the defaults
00:30:45 <gnarface> people who want more control over it use zsh instead
00:33:12 <msiism> i believe this is not what this is about. there's no delay. it simply hangs until you hit ctrl+c, and then fills in what it should have filled in when you hit the tab key.
00:33:22 <gnarface> hmm, that is weird
00:33:42 <msiism> also, if this was a bash auto-completion issue, it would be easily reproducibale, i guess. this problem however isn't.
00:33:45 <ashleyk> use another terminal to check resource usage while its hanging
00:34:02 <ashleyk> or figure out how to use strace
00:34:07 <gnarface> yea, if it was a harddrive cache issue, you'd expect the I/O light to blink
00:35:48 <msiism> as for temrinals: all instances of urxvt on the same user account have the problem now. however, on my other user account the problem is not reproducible (both users were logged in before the device was plugged in and both use urxvt).
00:36:30 <gnarface> could it be some weird whitespace character in a custom prompt that shouldn't be there, or something like that?
00:38:31 <msiism> the prompt is the standard one, as far as i can see in ~/.bashrc
00:38:50 <msiism> also, pmount is the only command for which i have ever seen that problem.
00:39:34 <msiism> just tried xterm. same result.
00:39:40 <gnarface> hmm. weird
00:39:48 <gnarface> i don't have pmount installed
00:40:00 <gnarface> but i wonder what makes it get treated differently
00:40:31 <gnarface> do you have anything weird listed for it in /etc/bash_completion.d/ ?
00:41:39 <msiism> file `pmount` exists there, interesting...
00:41:55 <gnarface> check it
00:42:10 <gnarface> maybe it will be ... computationally heavy somehow
00:42:17 <msiism> are you running ASCII?
00:42:27 <gnarface> yes just not on this machine i'm on right now
00:43:05 <gnarface> hmm, but i don't have pmount on the nearest ascii box either
00:43:11 <msiism> well, this file was last touched on 18 may 2014. i have never modified it.
00:43:14 <gnarface> it must not be a required package
00:43:26 <msiism> no, it's totally optional
00:43:38 <gnarface> well maybe the contents of /dev changed in some way though that affects it
00:43:58 <gnarface> i don't have anything else matching /d* or /de*, for example either...
00:44:20 <msiism> still, it shouldn't hang at `/dev`, since the only thing it would have to do there is adding a slash.
00:44:21 <gnarface> do you have anything else in your / that starts with "d" ?
00:44:44 <gnarface> if it's hanging at /dev instead of /de, then it would make sense that it has to be the contents of /dev it's not happy with
00:45:13 <gnarface> and a kernel change or just plugging in a bunch of usb devices might change the number of things showing up in there, as well as the amount of nested directory recursion required to cache it all
00:45:35 <gnarface> i wonder if there could be a weird character in a filename in there it doesn't like
00:46:41 <msiism> hanging on `/dev` (without the trailing slash) already is quite strange, though. i mean, there's really just a slash to add.
00:46:57 <msiism> and this ia also what pmount does on the other user account.
00:47:04 <gnarface> does it do the same thing if you type out /dev/ all the way then hit tab?
00:48:30 <msiism> `/de`, `/dev` and `/dev/`all lead to the same problem.
00:48:38 <gnarface> weird
00:48:47 <gnarface> it does suggest the contents of /dev/ are what it doesn't like
00:50:02 <msiism> if i hit tab on `/dev/` in the other account it just reacts normally, saying: "Display all 158 possibilities? (y or n)"
00:50:45 <gnarface> so that's interesting
00:50:53 <gnarface> could it be a permissions issue somehow?
00:51:01 <ashleyk> read this crap: https://www.phoronix.com/forums/forum/phoronix/general-discussion/1083082-systemd-free-debian-devuan-planning-their-first-developer-gathering-this-spring?p=1083165#post1083165
00:51:26 <msiism> gnarface: i don't think so.
00:51:59 <gnarface> it would be a file that has no read access in there for one of the users, or a directory that is missing read and execute, for just that one user.... i think
00:52:28 <msiism> gnarface: but that should not affect autocompletion in any way.
00:52:44 <gnarface> i guess i don't know that for sure
00:52:55 <gnarface> if it's trying to recurse directories in there to tab-complete
00:55:08 <msiism> gnarface: well, i don't think it does and still, if it would, /dev/sdb1 would no need such recursion. i just hope this is a problem related to the autocomplete script, not to pmount.
00:55:19 <msiism> let's see if i have zsh installed
00:55:54 <gnarface> so if you type pmount /dev/sd and then hit tab, does it still delay heavily?
00:56:19 <gnarface> i wonder if it's just a variation in drive response times to respond with the partition counts
00:56:41 <ashleyk> does pmount vs mount make a difference in the auto complete?
00:56:46 <msiism> gnarface: it's not about delay. it stops completely, like being stuck in an endless loop.
00:57:04 <gnarface> right, right.. hmmm...
00:57:17 <ashleyk> why not strace a bash
00:57:28 <ashleyk> and blindly do the bug, and see what it spams endlessly
00:58:03 <msiism> ok, zsh on the account there the problem occurs does not have the problem. going back to bash in the same temrinal gets me back to having the problem. that's a strong hint towards the problem being with the completion script.
00:58:26 <msiism> s/there/where
00:58:44 <ashleyk> why settle for hints when you can find out for sure
00:59:06 <msiism> ashleyk: right. so let's use strace. how is that done?
01:00:14 * msiism reads `man strace`
01:05:13 <ashleyk> well probably just strace /bin/bash, and then blindly, as i said, recreate the bug, and most likely (if it traces the completion script) it will be spamming something over and over again
01:05:28 <ashleyk> and that will be what it is stuck on
01:05:53 <msiism> here we go: https://bpaste.net/show/2546208900c1
01:06:43 <ashleyk> hmm, so it doesnt get stuck in a loop then?
01:06:48 <ashleyk> just prints that once, eh
01:07:45 <msiism> yes, that's all it gives me after hitting tab.
01:07:59 <tuxd3v> Hello guys
01:08:01 <msiism> ...and then after hitting crtl+c
01:08:09 <tuxd3v> still stuck eith Uboot
01:08:28 <tuxd3v> doesn any one knows what is the default baudrate for seryal?
01:08:36 <tuxd3v> sunxi-common.h
01:08:39 <tuxd3v> https://paste2.org/sUnh8ZxU
01:08:45 <gnarface> tuxd3v: the max is the default these days
01:08:52 <tuxd3v> could I be correct: 1500000
01:08:52 <ashleyk> is it 150000
01:08:57 <gnarface> uh no
01:09:01 <gnarface> that's way above the max
01:09:24 <gnarface> try it with 115200
01:09:37 <tuxd3v> It doesn't show up
01:09:44 <gnarface> oh, hmmm
01:09:52 <gnarface> well on my pine book that's what wokred
01:09:54 <gnarface> worked
01:10:04 <tuxd3v> what I did:
01:10:06 <tuxd3v> dd if=/dev/zero of=/dev/mmcblk0 bs=1k count=1023 seek=1
01:10:15 <tuxd3v> dd if=/home/rock64/u-boot-sunxi-with-spl.bin of=/dev/mmcblk0 bs=1024 seek=8
01:10:23 <ashleyk> i got devuan on my nanopc-t4, so im happy :)
01:10:28 <ashleyk> didnt try serial
01:10:50 <gnarface> tuxd3v: drop bs, count, and seek from your first dd if you're trying to actually zero that whole sd card
01:11:16 <tuxd3v> I am trying to zero the first 1MB or so
01:11:22 <tuxd3v> were fits the ubbot
01:11:28 <gnarface> but you skipped over it
01:11:36 <gnarface> i think...
01:11:43 <gnarface> or at least the first block
01:11:48 <gnarface> anyway i'm not sure that' what you want to do
01:11:50 <gnarface> just zero the whole thing
01:11:51 <ashleyk> skips the first 1k
01:12:22 <gnarface> for my pinebook the last thing stopping the serial terminal from working was just that i wasn't aware i had to actually add a kernel command-line variable to define it
01:12:27 <gnarface> and i think something to /etc/inittab?
01:12:44 <gnarface> i forget now, i gotta stop doing that stuff drunk, or just keep better notes...
01:13:01 <ashleyk> taking notes while drunk sounds realistic
01:14:07 <gnarface> but for sure the kernel command-line parameter was needed
01:14:21 <ashleyk> gnarface, where did you set that?
01:14:53 <gnarface> um, good question. it would be /etc/default/grub on a pc.... but for arm hardware...
01:14:55 <ashleyk> does uboot pass that, or is it built into the kernel
01:15:05 <gnarface> somewhere in uboot i'd have to guess
01:15:13 <ashleyk> i know how rpi and odroid work, but im not sure about this uboot stuff
01:15:23 <gnarface> or somewhere in the /boot partition at least, yea
01:15:34 <ashleyk> heh, i think /boot is blank
01:15:43 <ashleyk> probably getting more common
01:19:18 <gnarface> ah yes
01:19:22 <gnarface> boot.scr
01:19:36 <gnarface> boot.scr, that's where the kernel command line goes on my pinebook, ashleyk, tuxd3v
01:19:57 <ashleyk> where is that file?
01:20:18 <ashleyk> on a fat partition or in /boot on a linux partition or in the uboot build dir... heh i dont know the basics
01:20:48 <gnarface> it's one of the files you have to dd to the early sectors of the disk manually, for my pinebook. though it would be different for other arm devices. on rpi devices for example, you just add it to a text file in /boot
01:21:48 <gnarface> arm stuff doesn't seem to have settled on standard behaviors for this type of stuff. it's quickly one of the first things you miss about a PC is having a proper BIOS
01:22:13 <tuxd3v> yes boot.scr is the compiled version of boot.cmd text file with kernel boot args
01:22:32 <tuxd3v> but some use Uenv.txt
01:22:38 <gnarface> hmm. yea
01:22:40 <tuxd3v> uEnv.txt
01:22:42 <gnarface> i did it with the boot.cmd
01:22:47 <tuxd3v> others use boot.cmd
01:23:01 <ashleyk> heh, right on, thanks
01:23:20 <tuxd3v> then you need to pass the boot.cmd from text to bynary
01:23:29 <tuxd3v> which will be boot .scr
01:23:35 <tuxd3v> boot.scr
01:24:59 <gnarface> setenv bootargs console=ttyS0,115200 console=tty0 root=/dev/mmcblk2p2 net.ifnames=0 rootwait panic=10
01:25:08 <gnarface> so here's the kernel command-line i put in there
01:25:15 <gnarface> note "console=" defined twice
01:25:19 <gnarface> the first one being the serial one
01:25:45 <gnarface> for the *pinebook* 115200 was what i was told was the maximum, though i didn't test at higher speeds
01:27:49 <gnarface> i thought that was actually the maximum standard value but my google searches tell me that later, faster speeds were added to the standard
01:28:03 <gnarface> you may still have trouble going faster than 115200 over gator clips to coat hanger wire though....
01:37:39 <ashleyk> heh are you remote viewing tuxd3v
01:56:40 <tuxd3v> only black
01:58:46 <tuxd3v> I added bl32 from arm
01:58:50 <tuxd3v> for secure boot
01:59:01 <tuxd3v> maybe that its messing with something here..
01:59:17 <gnarface> well it has to be the right version
01:59:27 <gnarface> there's basically two major branches going
01:59:47 <gnarface> there's the commercial branch based on some ancient 3.x kernel using official firmware, which is what all the commercial vendors still use because of android
02:00:01 <gnarface> and then there's the "mainline" branch going for more modern kernel support
02:00:08 <gnarface> but all the little bits inbetween aren't cross-compatible
02:00:26 <gnarface> u-boot and all it's dozen or so forks included
02:01:05 <tuxd3v> I am on mailine kernel plus master branch of uboot
02:01:16 <tuxd3v> the standard..
02:01:20 <gnarface> so you have to make sure you're getting atf, bl32, dtb, and whatever else, are for the exact right versions
02:01:49 <gnarface> i'm using someone's 4th party patches for a 3rd party fork of u-boot called "das u-boot"
02:02:04 <gnarface> (and accompanying dtb and kernel patches)
02:02:26 <gnarface> when i set it up, there was no mainline support for the hardware though
02:02:42 <gnarface> i think it's been recently merged or will be merged soon into kernel 5.x but ymmv for your hardware
02:02:49 <gnarface> you might still need some 3rd party patches
02:03:22 <tuxd3v> yeah it could be the case here
02:10:54 <enyc> devuan mirror failing?
02:10:56 <enyc> E: Failed to fetch http://debian.bio.lmu.de/debian/pool/main/l/linux/linux-compiler-gcc-6-x86_4.19.28-2~bpo9+1_amd64.deb 404 Not Found [IP: 2001:4ca0:4300::1:22 80]
02:11:00 <enyc> E: Failed to fetch http://debian.bio.lmu.de/debian/pool/main/l/linux/linux-kbuild-4.19_4.19.28-2~bpo9+1_amd64.deb 404 Not Found [IP: 2001:4ca0:4300::1:22 80]
02:11:12 <enyc> Err:1 http://deb.devuan.org//merged ascii-backports/main amd64 linux-compiler-gcc-6-x86 amd64 4.19.28-2~bpo9+1
02:13:07 <gnarface> enyc: maybe, or maybe it's just in the middle of an update. deb.devuan.org is a round-robin though, so i wouldn't panic unless it happens twice in a row
02:13:36 <gnarface> if you just try again, it should pick a different mirror and work
02:17:44 <stiltr> gnarface: I was pretty sure "das u-boot" == "u-boot"...?
02:18:31 <gnarface> stiltr: i thought i had read otherwise, but it's possible nobody is using the original for mainline support anymore
02:18:47 <gnarface> or i could have just read it wrong
02:19:31 <stiltr> You could be right. I don't know for sure.
02:22:23 <stiltr> According to wikipedia they're the same...
02:22:24 <stiltr> https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Das_U-Boot#History
02:24:54 <enyc> gnarface: happened 3 times so fa...
02:25:16 <gnarface> enyc: hmm. that's disturbing. your sources.list is deb.devuan.org right?
02:25:38 <enyc> deb http://gb.deb.devuan.org/merged/ ascii-backports main contrib non-free
02:25:38 <enyc> deb-src http://gb.deb.devuan.org/merged/ ascii-backports main contrib non-free
02:25:44 <enyc> and same for -updates -security -main
02:26:00 <enyc> -proposed is in /devual/ inshead
02:26:42 <enyc> tho when i 'apt-get update' it only talks about deb.devuan.org rather than gb. ...
02:27:38 <enyc> and indeed when you do the 'get' it downloads various -security pfilesa nd he 2 -backpots packages, fail ...
02:27:44 <enyc> it may be backports specific issue, possibly.
02:28:32 <gnarface> yea, the country-specific redirects are not customized yet to countries, i don't think
02:28:36 <gnarface> there's only like 13 mirrors
02:29:07 <gnarface> but you do want to make sure your dns is up to date on them
02:29:40 <enyc> I don't have any local dns overrides or special extra dns caching
02:29:59 <enyc> just, normal compliant dns resolvers
02:30:02 <enyc> and forwarders
02:30:45 <enyc> debian mirrors carrying linux-compiler-gcc-6-x86_4.19.28-2~bpo9+1_amd64.deb ok
02:31:02 <enyc> aaah it seems like the undperpininng debian morrir is not updating the backported package hrrm
02:32:40 <enyc> https://mirror-master.debian.org/status/mirror-status.html
02:32:49 <enyc> does not list debian.bio.lmu.de at all ....
02:33:17 <enyc> so either theres' some multi level redirect going on that i don't understand or devuan directing to an undelpful debian package mirror
02:36:47 <gnarface> enyc: well, there is redirects. the devuan servers redirect to debian servers for unchanged packages
02:36:56 <gnarface> (which is still most of them)
02:37:07 <enyc> gnarface: which debian services and which devuan personnell manage that?
02:37:22 <enyc> i suspect a fault or somehow got 'stuck' on wrong debian.bio.lmu.de target or so
02:37:39 <gnarface> can i see your sources.list? can you paste it to paste.debian.net?
02:37:53 <enyc> i already gave you relevant lines above but
02:37:53 <gnarface> also make sure you don't have anything extraneous in sources.list.d/
02:38:01 <gnarface> i just wanna see the whole thing to be sure
02:38:08 <gnarface> you're probably right, it's probably a down mirror
02:38:24 <gnarface> but there should be plenty to go around unless your ISP is blocking the majority of them somehow
02:38:45 <gnarface> in fact, you might want to just try it with pkgmaster.devuan.org instead to be sure
02:49:13 <enyc> ^^ as gnarface confirms looks like devuan issue with redirctor
02:49:23 <enyc> -> -> devuan-dev channel?
02:50:14 <gnarface> maybe, or just ask KatolaZ or Centurion_Dan if they know about it
02:50:14 <msiism> enyc: sure, you can try.
02:50:26 <gnarface> not sure if they're around right now
02:50:44 <gnarface> enyc: did you try it against pkgmaster.devuan.org instead of deb.devuan.org ot see if it works differently?
02:51:33 <enyc> gnarface: no ... can try
02:53:56 <enyc> gnarface: successful rertrieve via Get:1 http://pkgmaster.devuan.org/merged ascii-backports/main amd64 linux-compiler-gcc-6-x86 amd64 4.19.28-2~bpo9+1 [241 kB]
02:54:52 <gnarface> enyc: vaguely suggests to me a DNS problem upstream of you. you're using your ISP DNS servers, right? they could have implemented abnormally high caching for load reasons
02:55:25 <enyc> gnarface: no, not that sort of isp
03:24:38 <ashleyk> that phoronix thread about the devuan dev conference is a shitshow
03:28:19 <specing> somebody contact green hat hackers about it :)
03:29:16 <ashleyk> ah i see a post from tuxd3v :D
03:33:51 <ashleyk> where do these people come from
03:33:54 <ashleyk> watch what i can do
03:33:58 <ashleyk> "I think at this point it's clear to see that mental illness and anti-systemd behaviour are related. No valid argument against it has ever been presented to this day.
03:34:11 <ashleyk> "I think at this point it's clear to see that mental illness and anti-ObamaCare behaviour are related. No valid argument against it has ever been presented to this day."
03:36:06 <ashleyk> sorry, its a devuan thread, but i guess these people are from california or something because they all sound the same
03:37:13 <gnarface> spam bots
03:37:15 <gnarface> paid shills
03:37:45 <ashleyk> some of them sure seem paid, or otherwise like full on communist sympathizers
03:38:38 <ashleyk> its just annoying when people say stuff like "the science is settled" or whatever
03:38:43 <gnarface> once you recognize how hard they are trying to squash it and how hard they are trying to make it look "natural" it's easy to see how bad they are at pretending to even be human. unfortunately, the stupider 70% of the population will latch on to this and go with it due to the perception that it is peer pressure
03:38:44 <redrick> California folk snakker det samme? (California people all sound the same?)
03:38:45 <ashleyk> and no one can question anything they are forcing on everyone
03:40:10 <ashleyk> change for the sake of destroying what is good
03:40:17 <redrick> Anyway, trolls gotta troll, and Web reader comment threads are, in general, where souls go to die.
03:40:18 <ashleyk> seems the trend
03:41:19 <ashleyk> its like the monsanto internet defense team got redirected to defend redhat
03:42:17 <gnarface> well in all likelyhood they are in fact hiring the exact same guerilla PR agency
03:43:21 <ashleyk> literally
03:43:46 <ashleyk> and btw, the centos and rhel irc channels are some of the most elitist authoritarian irc channels on freenode
03:44:24 <ashleyk> ibm buys redhat, bayer buys monsanto all scum
03:45:20 <ashleyk> bayer sold aids infected childrens medication on purpose, and ibm programmed the holocaust machines on purpose
03:45:34 <ashleyk> monsanto sold glyphosate (carcinogen) on purpose
03:45:38 <ashleyk> redhat created systemd on purpose
03:45:55 <ashleyk> just the facts
03:46:52 <ashleyk> tbh glyphosate is far worse than a carcinogen, but do your own research on that, they are just losing lawsuits for it being a carcinogen as a smokescreen from its worse effects
03:49:37 <gnarface> ashleyk: you're probably not wrong, but you should rant in #debianfork instead of here
03:50:43 <ashleyk> i know, but cant delete from irc...and didnt want to leave out anything :p
04:07:06 <specing> ibm is cool, power9 cpus are by far the most open you can get
04:07:10 <specing> even foss microcode
04:07:21 <msiism> ashleyk: don't get what this all has to do with communism, though. it might have with your idea of it, ok. but, imho, it's not the most clever thing to throw these things out in public.
04:07:48 <MinceR> ibm ceased to be cool when they bought red hat, if they were cool before that
04:08:13 <ashleyk> msiism, sorry for ranting, but also keep an eye on what is going on in the rest of the OSS "community"
04:08:18 <ashleyk> and tell me im wrong
04:08:50 <msiism> ashleyk: no thanks.
04:09:13 <msiism> s/no/no,
04:09:28 <ashleyk> ok then be uninformed
04:11:00 <ashleyk> next they will takeover the kernel, then force code of conduct on everyone (which is very hypocritical), then continue ranting about the meritocracy and patriarchy or w/e, but hey, just defend them :)
04:11:41 <gnarface> well, IBM actually might care more about CPU security than Intel
04:11:47 <gnarface> and that might actually be a reason to side with them for now
04:11:51 <msiism> ashleyk: just let it go, i'm not gonna enter into such a debate. i have better things to do.
04:12:01 <gnarface> (not on the redhat thing, but at least on the power9 thing)
04:12:45 <ashleyk> msiism, good one
04:12:54 <gnarface> i don't think IBM is actually the driving force behind what RedHat is doing, i think they are just opportunists. i could be wrong though.
04:13:18 <msiism> ashleyk: if you want to troll, choose another channel.
04:13:54 <ashleyk> literally derp
04:14:22 * unixman makes popcorn
04:15:17 <ashleyk> try to control someones speech, then say you dont want to debate it, then call someone a troll, then /quit
04:15:53 <ashleyk> gnarface, well ibm saw the value in redhat only recently i guess...
04:17:12 <unixman> Well, TBH, this is not the channel for that debate / discussion, ashleyk. If it is Devaun related, Devuan support question for example, that goes here. Otherwise, not.
04:17:39 <ashleyk> unixman, yeah i know, quit bringing it up unless you want to debate me in PM
04:17:55 <ashleyk> or just /quit if you want to be a troll
04:18:22 <unixman> ashleyk, Red Hat and IBM for example are not Devuan.
04:19:43 <ashleyk> unixman, pm me if you want to discuss
04:20:39 <MinceR> 03 211254 < gnarface> i don't think IBM is actually the driving force behind what RedHat is doing, i think they are just opportunists.
04:20:43 <MinceR> neither did they stop it
04:20:58 <MinceR> then again, wikipedia says it's "(pending)"
04:21:02 <MinceR> so maybe i jumped the gun here
04:21:14 <unixman> I don't care about the Red Hat, et cetera, "discussion", frankly. Anyway, I'm just driving by to see why the channel is highlighted. BBL
04:21:49 <MinceR> i want red hat to be wiped from the face of the universe
04:22:53 <ashleyk> unixman, yeah my bad, i was just ranting / drawing correlations between the tactics used by anti-(init)-freedom people in the devuan developer gathering phoronix thread...the tactics are the fingerprint
04:25:04 <ashleyk> Hi there, This is already something that is on our radar. We see this as an opportunity for a non-systemd distro which would be a great alternative to what we currently offer. We don't have any definite plans yet but hopefully we will soon. When that happens we'll make a public announcement. Regards, AJ de Leon Linode Support Team
04:25:36 <ashleyk> my linode ticket got a response
04:27:23 <ashleyk> and i didnt even mention systemd
04:28:26 <ashleyk> apparently they "get it" :)
05:12:30 <Digit> lol. the april fools gopherhole got some folks upset?! XD and still causing fallout? XD lol. less funny was the suggestion: " a much more appropriate/harmless joke would have been a note about e.g. devuan switching to systemd." noooooo. gopher was whimsical. dont want pro-systemd misinformation perchance taking root in the soft minded.
05:14:22 <rwp> I think it was the statement that the devuan site was p0wned that was most worriesome.
05:14:54 <rwp> It Trust is hard to gain but easy to lose.
05:14:59 <rwp> *Trust is hard to gain but easy to lose.
05:20:19 <gnarface> it goes both ways though
05:21:11 <gnarface> people still parroting as fact that it was a real breach, months in the future, will expose themselves as enemy agents or pawns of them
05:21:25 <furrywolf> my april fools day joke was sending a fake email to all our drivers announcing the truck wouldn't be in until 4:01pm, each person had 401 stops, the forecast was for 4.01 inches of rain, and from now on in addition to a signature, every delivery would need social security number and date of birth. the last words of it were "april fools". at least one person believed it.
05:21:37 <furrywolf> soft-mindedness is not rare, sadly...
05:22:01 <unixman> a. One hears that Devuan web site was pwned. b. One wobbles. c. One hears it was an April Fool's joke. d. One recovers. If "d." doesn't happen then One has a personal problem.
05:22:58 <furrywolf> speaking of which.. bbl, work.
06:01:41 <ashleyk> sigh, devuan mailinglist is marked as Junk Mail.
06:07:56 <tuxd3v> Need to get 2X4GB ddr2 asap..
06:08:41 <tuxd3v> my Xeon is killing me with only 4GB
06:11:03 <nemo> tuxd3v: yeah, you definitely need more. memory is dirt cheap these days
06:11:21 <nemo> HDs are much snappier w/ like 16-32 gigs of commonly accessed stuff in RAM ☺
06:12:29 <ashleyk> my laptop has 16gb, and its barely enough
06:16:24 <tuxd3v> yeah It will have another life
06:17:14 <tuxd3v> (GB its the minimum nowadays, I have in my desktop 32 Gb, and its awesome
06:17:31 <tuxd3v> but for compiling code, I like this machine
06:17:54 <tuxd3v> with 4GB its almost madness to compile big projects here
06:18:33 <tuxd3v> But Ram is also danger...becasue of the cache..
06:18:48 <tuxd3v> When you moove big amounts of data
06:19:07 <enyc> x201-tablet with 8gb ram max bah!
06:19:34 <tuxd3v> I still prefer a Xeon :)
06:25:25 <enyc> tuxd3v: =)
06:26:12 <tuxd3v> <ashleyk>, I saw you talking about phoronix thread..
06:26:28 <tuxd3v> I was too naive, in a lot of aspects..
06:26:46 <tuxd3v> it was dirty, but I lerned the lesson
06:26:54 <tuxd3v> learned
06:27:06 <ashleyk> i didnt read the whole thread yet...just saw your first post in it
06:29:11 <tuxd3v> recently gentoo guys suceded in freeing Gnome 3 from systemd last piece also with elogind
06:29:38 <ashleyk> i havent given gentoo a thought since like 2005
06:29:59 <MinceR> too bad elogind stinks
06:30:21 <MinceR> it at least used to kill processes when you logged out, which was fucked up when systemd did it too
08:26:05 <Digit> saw this image, and thought of the fuss here about 04-01 https://diasp.eu/uploads/images/scaled_full_b3394d7be4b2e15e6ede.jpg
08:27:03 <tuxd3v> Well, it his partially true
08:27:11 <tuxd3v> thanks for sharing
08:27:43 <tuxd3v> But we should look around and check what options exist and what fullfills the better one for our Society
08:27:51 <tuxd3v> Choice is Freedom
2019-04-03
next