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		<title><![CDATA[Dev1 Galaxy Forum / Need advice, building a small server for city-library-Devuan mirror]]></title>
		<link>https://dev1galaxy.org/viewtopic.php?id=7242</link>
		<description><![CDATA[The most recent posts in Need advice, building a small server for city-library-Devuan mirror.]]></description>
		<lastBuildDate>Wed, 18 Jun 2025 12:18:31 +0000</lastBuildDate>
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			<title><![CDATA[Re: Need advice, building a small server for city-library-Devuan mirror]]></title>
			<link>https://dev1galaxy.org/viewtopic.php?pid=56153#p56153</link>
			<description><![CDATA[<p>hope it&#039;s not covid</p><p><a href="https://arstechnica.com/health/2025/06/new-covid-variant-swiftly-gains-ground-in-us-concern-looms-for-summer-wave/" rel="nofollow"> https://arstechnica.com/health/2025/06/new-covid-variant-swiftly-gains-ground-in-us-concern-looms-for-summer-wave/</a></p>]]></description>
			<author><![CDATA[dummy@example.com (stargate-sg1-cheyenne-mtn)]]></author>
			<pubDate>Wed, 18 Jun 2025 12:18:31 +0000</pubDate>
			<guid>https://dev1galaxy.org/viewtopic.php?pid=56153#p56153</guid>
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			<title><![CDATA[Re: Need advice, building a small server for city-library-Devuan mirror]]></title>
			<link>https://dev1galaxy.org/viewtopic.php?pid=56152#p56152</link>
			<description><![CDATA[<p>^^^ That&#039;s incredibly kind my friend, i&#039;ll have to think about that one.</p><p>Unfortunately I seem to have come down with the flu late last week, and it&#039;s still hammering me really hard, so all my projects are on hold for the moment as I barely have the energy to type.</p><p>Haven&#039;t been this sick since I had pneumonia 25 years ago. <img src="https://dev1galaxy.org/img/smilies/sad.png" width="15" height="15" alt="sad" /></p>]]></description>
			<author><![CDATA[dummy@example.com (greenjeans)]]></author>
			<pubDate>Wed, 18 Jun 2025 12:04:55 +0000</pubDate>
			<guid>https://dev1galaxy.org/viewtopic.php?pid=56152#p56152</guid>
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			<title><![CDATA[Re: Need advice, building a small server for city-library-Devuan mirror]]></title>
			<link>https://dev1galaxy.org/viewtopic.php?pid=56083#p56083</link>
			<description><![CDATA[<p>think i have some thinkstation S20 workstations that i believe are pre-uefi if you would be interested in good serviceable free stuff.</p><p>naturally there would be some S&amp;H unless you&#039;re close enough for a pickup/delivery/meet-in-the-middle-exchange. what is your zip?</p>]]></description>
			<author><![CDATA[dummy@example.com (stargate-sg1-cheyenne-mtn)]]></author>
			<pubDate>Thu, 12 Jun 2025 15:53:57 +0000</pubDate>
			<guid>https://dev1galaxy.org/viewtopic.php?pid=56083#p56083</guid>
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			<title><![CDATA[Re: Need advice, building a small server for city-library-Devuan mirror]]></title>
			<link>https://dev1galaxy.org/viewtopic.php?pid=56082#p56082</link>
			<description><![CDATA[<p>As a lifelong AMD guy I am going to go against the grain here a little bit and suggest a 12th-14th gen Intel on sale at Newegg with a B series motherboard(be sure to get a chip with an iGPU). Darn near every time I try to run Consumer level Ryzen hardware as a server I get bit in the A__ by some ram or motherboard quirk. </p><p>All that aside KEEP YOUR SOFTWARE SEPARATE FROM YOUR DATA. Have your OS on a separate drive or raid array than your data. JMHO I would setup timeshift on your OS drive and at least a RAID1 on your data possibly a RAID10 but that might be overkill. And then have some old POS machine in the corner with a RAID1 or just 2 drives doing nightly RSYNC backups from the main server. </p><p>What I do at work is I have a spare drive in our server getting RSYNCED 5 days worth of our critical data to the secondary drive, I then have that POS machine in the corner with 2 drives making 2 copies (no need for raid) and that machine RSYNCs nightly up to RSYNC.net</p>]]></description>
			<author><![CDATA[dummy@example.com (yurimodin)]]></author>
			<pubDate>Thu, 12 Jun 2025 14:53:10 +0000</pubDate>
			<guid>https://dev1galaxy.org/viewtopic.php?pid=56082#p56082</guid>
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			<title><![CDATA[Re: Need advice, building a small server for city-library-Devuan mirror]]></title>
			<link>https://dev1galaxy.org/viewtopic.php?pid=56081#p56081</link>
			<description><![CDATA[<div class="quotebox"><cite>greenjeans wrote:</cite><blockquote><div><p>I wonder if it will be a software issue going forward if I used a non-uefi system to start with if the board will support it?</p></div></blockquote></div><p>Highly unlikely. The only software that cares about UEFI/MBR distinctions is the bootloader and whatever is installing/updating it, and I don&#039;t see GRUB or LILO dropping MBR support any time soon.<br />If it ever did come to that, converting an installed system to UEFI isn&#039;t particularly difficult anyway.</p><p>The more likely scenario is that at some point you will need to replace the motherboard, and find you have to pay a premium for one that still supports MBR boot. </p><p>What you *need* UEFI for is booting from (almost all) NVME drives, and that is a technical/architectural limitation... So as storage moves in that direction, sooner or later you will have to adapt.</p><p>Also worthy of side-note is that resizable BAR (or whatever $GPU_vendor is calling it these days) support in BIOS is currently being used as a wedge to push people toward UEFI. There&#039;s no technical reason for one to require the other, but that&#039;s what consumer board vendors (and more to the point, Microsoft) are doing.</p><div class="quotebox"><cite>Dutch_Master wrote:</cite><blockquote><div><p>I&#039;d suggest being practical and consider specific NAS-OS&#039;s like HexOS, TrueNAS Scale, UnRAID or ProxMox instead.</p></div></blockquote></div><p>Why? We&#039;re not talking about a home NAS here, and using a turnkey NAS distro adds precious little of value to a webserver.</p><div class="quotebox"><cite>Dutch_Master wrote:</cite><blockquote><div><p>online criminals will have a field day hacking your machine and turning it to making them money whichever way they want</p></div></blockquote></div><p>If you are an idiot and run compromised or misconfigured services, sure. Or you could... *shock* read the Debian security manual.<br />I know plenty of people (myself included) running public webservers on general-purpose GNU/Linux or BSD distros, none of them have been pwned, and I call FUD. <img src="https://dev1galaxy.org/img/smilies/roll.png" width="15" height="15" alt="roll" /></p><div class="quotebox"><cite>Dutch_Master wrote:</cite><blockquote><div><p>Devuan simply doesn&#039;t have a GUI tool that makes configuring it suitable for online use, like HexOS is for TrueNAS.</p></div></blockquote></div><p>Devuan is exactly as &quot;suitable for online use&quot; as Debian, and both can do everything TrueNAS does if configured appropriately.<br />Debian powers vast numbers of webservers and has for decades, whether it has an easy-mode &quot;GUI tool&quot; or &quot;setup wizard&quot; for a given role is neither here nor there. &quot;Universal operating system&quot; and all that.</p><p>I&#039;m not knocking TrueNAS mind, it&#039;s a fine distro... Claiming that it&#039;s somehow more reliable or more secure than Devuan because it has a graphical wizard though, that&#039;s kinda ridiculous... As is shelling out $199 per box for HexOS beta, the mind boggles.</p>]]></description>
			<author><![CDATA[dummy@example.com (steve_v)]]></author>
			<pubDate>Thu, 12 Jun 2025 12:40:07 +0000</pubDate>
			<guid>https://dev1galaxy.org/viewtopic.php?pid=56081#p56081</guid>
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			<title><![CDATA[Re: Need advice, building a small server for city-library-Devuan mirror]]></title>
			<link>https://dev1galaxy.org/viewtopic.php?pid=56080#p56080</link>
			<description><![CDATA[<p>Very peculiar opinions you are voicing there. Especially I would consider &quot;GUI tool that makes configuring it for online use&quot; being a quite oxymoronic phrase. It&#039;s kind of like saying: &quot;but he is friendly to the kids&quot;. Of course, I voice my opinion here.</p>]]></description>
			<author><![CDATA[dummy@example.com (ralph.ronnquist)]]></author>
			<pubDate>Thu, 12 Jun 2025 06:52:24 +0000</pubDate>
			<guid>https://dev1galaxy.org/viewtopic.php?pid=56080#p56080</guid>
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			<title><![CDATA[Re: Need advice, building a small server for city-library-Devuan mirror]]></title>
			<link>https://dev1galaxy.org/viewtopic.php?pid=56079#p56079</link>
			<description><![CDATA[<p>Nobody ever got fired for buying a Dell. Same goes for HP, IBM and Lenovo.</p><p>Despite having my daily driver PC on AMD hardware for the past 25 yrs, I&#039;d suggest you&#039;d hunt down an older workstation (Intel 10th, 11th or 12th gen CPU) for cheap, maximize RAM, add 2-4 HDD&#039;s for long term storage in RAID 1, 5 or 6, a 1TB NVMe SSD for the OS and any VM&#039;s you&#039;d like to run.</p><p>As for the OS: Although Devuan can do all the tasks you planned for, I&#039;d suggest being practical and consider specific NAS-OS&#039;s like HexOS, TrueNAS Scale, UnRAID or ProxMox instead. Yes, they use systemd and as much as I despise it, realistically that&#039;s not going away anytime soon. As your only online portal for your community, downtime due to having to tinker with a manual Devuan setup isn&#039;t really acceptable. You&#039;d also need to consider online risks: you may not consider your community a target, online criminals will have a field day hacking your machine and turning it to making them money whichever way they want. Devuan simply doesn&#039;t have a GUI tool that makes configuring it suitable for online use, like HexOS is for TrueNAS. The project lacks the resources and realistically, it&#039;s not gonna happen anytime soon, even if someone steps up developing the required functionality for it today.</p>]]></description>
			<author><![CDATA[dummy@example.com (Dutch_Master)]]></author>
			<pubDate>Thu, 12 Jun 2025 04:52:46 +0000</pubDate>
			<guid>https://dev1galaxy.org/viewtopic.php?pid=56079#p56079</guid>
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			<title><![CDATA[Re: Need advice, building a small server for city-library-Devuan mirror]]></title>
			<link>https://dev1galaxy.org/viewtopic.php?pid=56076#p56076</link>
			<description><![CDATA[<p>Hello:</p><div class="quotebox"><cite>greenjeans wrote:</cite><blockquote><div><p>One big question ...</p></div></blockquote></div><p>I can feel your pain from way down here.&#160; 8^°</p><p>Food for thought:<br />From your OP I gather that $$$ is a limitation and a very understandable one.</p><p>As you know, I run my Devuan system on a ca. 2007 Sun Microsystems Ultra 24 WS.<br />Doesn&#039;t ever skip a beat and it is the best IT purchase I <span class="bbu">ever</span> made.<br />The box is built like a tank, way ahead of its time when it came out and still was 10 years later.<br />You don&#039;t get hardware like this anymore.</p><p>Why not consider an older, high quality box to populate with enough RAM, SAS controller / drives and a pair of 4port Gigabit cards?<br />I think that is where you will get the best bang for your town&#039;s money.<br />And no EFI ...</p><p>eg: a Sun Microsystems Ultra 40 M2.</p><p>2x AMD 3.0 GHz Opteron dual-core processors + 32 GB of DDR2-667 ECC<br />2x 10/100/1000BASE-T Gigabit Ethernet ports<br />8x SATA / SAS HDD slots<br />2x PCIe x16 graphics slots<br />2x PCIe x8 expansion slots<br />1x PCI 33MHz, 32-bit slot</p><p>It probably has (like my U24) pins for a RS-232 port, which has to be enabled in BIOS.<br />Could be quite useful.</p><p>You can probably get a basic one for a good price and populate it according to your needs.</p><p>eg: run it with no monitor, use 1x PCIe x16 slot for a four port GbE card, 1x PCIe x16 slot an 8 port SAS controller and boot from a SSD drive on an adapter in one of the expansion slots and you will still have 1x PCIe x8 and 1x PCI 33MHz 32-bit slots for whatever else you want to stuff in there.</p><p>Just my 0.02 ...</p><p>Best,</p><p>A.</p>]]></description>
			<author><![CDATA[dummy@example.com (Altoid)]]></author>
			<pubDate>Wed, 11 Jun 2025 20:29:30 +0000</pubDate>
			<guid>https://dev1galaxy.org/viewtopic.php?pid=56076#p56076</guid>
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			<title><![CDATA[Re: Need advice, building a small server for city-library-Devuan mirror]]></title>
			<link>https://dev1galaxy.org/viewtopic.php?pid=56075#p56075</link>
			<description><![CDATA[<p>^^Oh that part I know already, I misspoke. What I meant to say was I wonder if it will be a software issue going forward if I used a non-uefi system to start with if the board will support it?</p>]]></description>
			<author><![CDATA[dummy@example.com (greenjeans)]]></author>
			<pubDate>Wed, 11 Jun 2025 20:20:36 +0000</pubDate>
			<guid>https://dev1galaxy.org/viewtopic.php?pid=56075#p56075</guid>
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			<title><![CDATA[Re: Need advice, building a small server for city-library-Devuan mirror]]></title>
			<link>https://dev1galaxy.org/viewtopic.php?pid=56074#p56074</link>
			<description><![CDATA[<p>EFI/MBR is a BIOS thing, grab the manual for the board you&#039;re considering. If it mentions &quot;legacy&quot; mode/CSM, you can likely still use MBR boot.</p>]]></description>
			<author><![CDATA[dummy@example.com (steve_v)]]></author>
			<pubDate>Wed, 11 Jun 2025 19:52:55 +0000</pubDate>
			<guid>https://dev1galaxy.org/viewtopic.php?pid=56074#p56074</guid>
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			<title><![CDATA[Re: Need advice, building a small server for city-library-Devuan mirror]]></title>
			<link>https://dev1galaxy.org/viewtopic.php?pid=56073#p56073</link>
			<description><![CDATA[<p>^^^ Yep that validates what i&#039;ve been reading, that ZFS is a must on the storage drives. And Nginx instead of Apache was mentioned many places as being the better choice. But now we&#039;re talking about software and i&#039;d like to keep this thread just about the hardware choices, i&#039;ll have a lot of questions later about software.</p><p>The list in the OP doesn&#039;t have a GPU, the integrated graphics are probably fine. But you did mention media transcoding, and that may be something i&#039;ll need to do here and there. It&#039;s ridiculously slow to do so on my APU-equipped laptop, would be nice to have something faster.</p><p>So the concensus seems to be do RAID1 for the OS too...interesting, not something I would have thought of.</p><p>One big question: Is this gonna work without EFI? Because I do hate it so.</p>]]></description>
			<author><![CDATA[dummy@example.com (greenjeans)]]></author>
			<pubDate>Wed, 11 Jun 2025 19:24:34 +0000</pubDate>
			<guid>https://dev1galaxy.org/viewtopic.php?pid=56073#p56073</guid>
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			<title><![CDATA[Re: Need advice, building a small server for city-library-Devuan mirror]]></title>
			<link>https://dev1galaxy.org/viewtopic.php?pid=56070#p56070</link>
			<description><![CDATA[<div class="quotebox"><cite>Eeqmcsq wrote:</cite><blockquote><div><p>I&#039;ve learned the hard way that SSDs aren&#039;t great for long term data storage, especially with static data (files that don&#039;t change). Based on what I can figure out from research, the SSDs memory cells suffer from voltage drift over time.</p></div></blockquote></div><p>I&#039;ve learned the hard way that *all* readily available storage media is subject to this kind of bitrot, and the only viable solution (besides exotic media like etched sapphire) is file and/or block checksums, regular readability tests, and sufficient redundancy for the inevitable repairs...<br />That means ZFS or BTRFS for anything important, with regular scrubs.</p><p>I&#039;ve had all manner of RAID failures and filesystem corruption over the years, but I haven&#039;t seen a single damaged file in the decade+ I&#039;ve been running ZFS on Debian/Devuan... <br />I do get the occasional:<br />&quot;One or more devices has experienced an unrecoverable error... Applications are unaffected... Determine if the device needs to be replaced... Repaired [x]M in [y] hours with 0 errors&quot; <br />type mail though, because all disks suck. <br />&quot;desktop&quot; disks suck hard, &quot;green&quot; disks suck harder, and &quot;laptop&quot; disks suck hardest of all. You get what you pay for, server (or &quot;NAS&quot;) grade storage is worth every penny in reducing both risk and aggravation. Goes for HDD, SSD, or NVME, the price/performance/reliability triangle is the same.</p><div class="quotebox"><cite>greenjeans wrote:</cite><blockquote><div><p>I have a preference for AMD CPU/GPU&#039;s as they generally play much better with linux than Nvidia does.</p></div></blockquote></div><p>GPU brand is utterly irrelevant for a webserver... having a GPU <em>at all</em> is irrelevant for that matter, the vast majority of webservers just use IPMI KVM or serial console. <br />Unless you need a GPU for media en/decoding or <del>AI nonsense</del> wasting energy, put those PCIe slots to a more constructive use like HBAs or more NICs.</p><p>There is a pretty good argument for AMD over Intel on the CPU front though, namely getting ECC support without the Xeon tax.</p><p>My take on storage would be ext4 on an (md)RAID1 of small SSDs for the OS and anything that doesn&#039;t play nice with COW filesystems (like the database if you CBF with filesystem tuning), and ZFS (mirror or RAIDZ) on 2 or 3 &quot;NAS&quot; grade spinners for data. </p><p>None of this is a substitute for backups of course, you should have those (and test them regularly) too.</p><p>As for other hardware, I&#039;m not up with current pricing so I don&#039;t have any specifics, but in general: ECC memory and plenty of it, a not-bargain-basement motherboard, and somewhere to put at least 2 (preferrably 4 or 5) drives.<br />Everything else is negotiable, CPU load serving mostly static web content will be bugger all and disk latency won&#039;t matter much if you have enough RAM for a decent cache.<br />You&#039;ll want a quality PSU and a UPS with monitoring properly configured as well of course.</p>]]></description>
			<author><![CDATA[dummy@example.com (steve_v)]]></author>
			<pubDate>Wed, 11 Jun 2025 13:08:15 +0000</pubDate>
			<guid>https://dev1galaxy.org/viewtopic.php?pid=56070#p56070</guid>
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			<title><![CDATA[Re: Need advice, building a small server for city-library-Devuan mirror]]></title>
			<link>https://dev1galaxy.org/viewtopic.php?pid=56069#p56069</link>
			<description><![CDATA[<p>You can install to RAID with the cli refractainstaller, but it won&#039;t take 10 minutes. It would probably be more like 15 minutes. RAID1 will prevent downtime, and you can make a cron job to check the drives and send you email and/or text message if one fails.</p><p>Update on these instructions - it says that partitions must end in a&#160; non-zero digit and that&#039;s no longer true. I fixed it long ago. You can use md0 and if you do lvm you don&#039;t have to end the lv name with a digit. (e.g. /dev/mapper/nodigitshere would work.)<br /><a href="https://dev1galaxy.org/viewtopic.php?id=2323" rel="nofollow">https://dev1galaxy.org/viewtopic.php?id=2323</a></p>]]></description>
			<author><![CDATA[dummy@example.com (fsmithred)]]></author>
			<pubDate>Wed, 11 Jun 2025 11:33:47 +0000</pubDate>
			<guid>https://dev1galaxy.org/viewtopic.php?pid=56069#p56069</guid>
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			<title><![CDATA[Re: Need advice, building a small server for city-library-Devuan mirror]]></title>
			<link>https://dev1galaxy.org/viewtopic.php?pid=56067#p56067</link>
			<description><![CDATA[<p>Handling multiple client requests might indeed be the logic behind the SSD rec, though I seriously don&#039;t expect a lot of traffic...i&#039;m flexible though, if we do go with an HDD instead of an SSD for the OS and it&#039;s not up to the task we can swap it out. </p><p>The RAID idea for the OS drive is compelling, have to think about that one a bit, my first instinct (and what I do at home) is roll up a copy using Refracta Snapshot, then if anything craps out it&#039;s just a 10 minute install to get back up and running.</p><p>Yeah I haven&#039;t put together a website in years, not looking forward to that part, but that will be a few months from now anyway, first priority is getting it set up and serving. I do have some friends though in that field that might help me out when it&#039;s time. I really miss the old Yahoo SiteBuilder to be honest, it was actually a great quick WYSIWYG editor for throwing up sites fast.</p>]]></description>
			<author><![CDATA[dummy@example.com (greenjeans)]]></author>
			<pubDate>Tue, 10 Jun 2025 22:04:49 +0000</pubDate>
			<guid>https://dev1galaxy.org/viewtopic.php?pid=56067#p56067</guid>
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			<title><![CDATA[Re: Need advice, building a small server for city-library-Devuan mirror]]></title>
			<link>https://dev1galaxy.org/viewtopic.php?pid=56066#p56066</link>
			<description><![CDATA[<p>That backup plan sounds similar to what I&#039;m doing at home for my work PCs. I have an HDD + SATA-to-USB3 dock, and I connect this to my work laptop once a week when it&#039;s time to back up the laptop&#039;s SSD by cloning the SSD to a file, something like &quot;dd if=/dev/sdx of=file.bin&quot;. I wrote my own script to do most of the dirty work, including checking the backup HDD&#039;s file system for errors, deleting old backups if there isn&#039;t enough space, and constructing a date/time for the backup file name.</p><p>One difference in your proposal compared to my home PCs is that my OS is also on a RAID1, so the OS can withstand a drive failure. That&#039;s saved me the time of having to reinstall and reconfigure the OS when one of the drives failed.</p><p>I think that&#039;s the limit of my home experiences that can apply to your project. From a brainstorming perspective, other issues that spring to mind are:</p><p>* Handling multiple client requests: If multiple client requests causes a lot of disk activity on the OS disk, maybe an SSD IS needed for the OS.</p><p>* Web page design: These days, web pages must be designed for mobile users, since everyone has a phone. I have no knowledge of modern web design.</p>]]></description>
			<author><![CDATA[dummy@example.com (Eeqmcsq)]]></author>
			<pubDate>Tue, 10 Jun 2025 21:20:56 +0000</pubDate>
			<guid>https://dev1galaxy.org/viewtopic.php?pid=56066#p56066</guid>
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