puff all the responses are "minimalist.. bloabed" but pretend to be "complete distro" .. minimalist does not work with blind persons.. yesterday tested devuan ascii and @mijailo arso reports that installer cause some problems https://t.me/DevuanGnuLinux/3165

it's not xtrange devuan ascii still cause problems for blind persons.. that not happened in debian 9 counterpart.. devuan 1.0 does not work well neither, important note: as it works for those who are in the forum/devel team, them ignore the real world outside, ... sad.. very sad

stop being a try hard troll.

https://pkginfo.devuan.org/cgi-bin/d1pk … ease=ascii

https://pkginfo.devuan.org/cgi-bin/d1pk … ease=ascii

https://pkginfo.devuan.org/cgi-bin/d1pk … ease=ascii

https://pkginfo.devuan.org/cgi-bin/d1pk … ease=ascii

it's not xtrange devuan ascii still cause problems for blind persons.. that not happened in debian 9 counterpart.. devuan 1.0 does not work well neither, important note: as it works for those who are in the forum/devel team, them ignore the real world outside, ... sad.. very sad

For the record, if XFCE ever gets tanked or (even more) bloated

Now XFCE is second GNOME. It happened several years ago. There are tons of lightweight options for desktop. May be it's time to use FVWM. For console users there is also awesome desktop environment called GNU Emacs.

For the record, if XFCE ever gets tanked or (even more) bloated, I'm all about a console-only devuan as the main base.

Then again, I'm also a psychopath when it comes to minimalism.  *places two cents in the jar*

I tried several WM: OpenBox, FluxBox, IceWM and JWM (last 3 were part of AntiX when I was trying that out). Of the 4 WM that I tried - JWM was overall winner with applications menu and a taskbar/panel that is closest in function to those found on full desktop environments like XFCE.

+1

When it comes to minimalism, JWM is the winner in my opinion too:
- it's easy to configure (one single configuration file and you don't need instructions to figure out what to do)
- very easy to use (it follows the user model)
- it has an elegant look without tweaking (and you can easily change it in the configuration file).

Another very nice WM is WindowMaker but probably not everyone is used to it. However, it has this advantage that you don't have to manually edit its configuration files.

Of the 4 WM that I tried - JWM was overall winner with applications menu and a taskbar/panel that is closest in function to those found on full desktop environments like XFCE..

seem do you not understand as "complete" but i try to clarify..

orca tryes to read any element on a window.. including those from proper window manager.. by exampel if you opens a windo menu from title bar.. will raise options like "stiky above" or "maximixe" or "over all desktop" but in case of openbvox that interface are GTK with proper theming..

blind persons that are one of my extreme examples wil lnot have a propeer support in devuan with refracta installer and al of those "derivates" work..

the other example, obviously if i try to install some things like oracle applications will fail ..

anydesk now install perfectly but ... well.. nomachine need tunning..

mckaygerhard wrote:

do you know that LXDE/LXQT git are directly the sources for packagin rather a tar watch as does traditionally with packages .. since almost always?

I'm aware that almost all packages start out as upstream tarballs that get turned into debian packages by debian developers.  They also get turned into other kinds of packages for other distros. But I don't understand what you're trying to say about lxde/lxqt.

you will notice the labor saving by seeing that lxde packages do not use tarball but the upstream url directly!

thas explain all the noise around the elogind problem.. well at least elogind are still there.. resolution B are not the best but was something! i dont know if the resolution voted was a help .. but .. well systemd guys still are there .. lest see how will result all of this!

has been a great improvement but notice the psychological wear it has caused .. let's remember that you guys don't have all the free time in the world .. and that they are not always enough .. lest remenber the noise about devuan.pro ...

how many years was passed .. umm only 3 years.. and there's less event more? puff we need change something for sure!

do you know that LXDE/LXQT git are directly the sources for packagin rather a tar watch as does traditionally with packages .. since almost always?

It might be five years. I'm not sure. The major change that I see is that jessie was 2 years late (after the release of debian jessie) ascii was one year late, and beowulf is about half a year late.  Collaborative efforts have sprung up between devuan and debian, and as a result, elogind is available in debian. I see new devuan developers who have arrived in the past year, and we continue to get new users who thought they were ok with systemd but changed their minds after they used it for some time. I think we're doing just fine.

I'm aware that almost all packages start out as upstream tarballs that get turned into debian packages by debian developers.  They also get turned into other kinds of packages for other distros. But I don't understand what you're trying to say about lxde/lxqt.

...Right now, there are too few of us, and we're all busy with other things.

how many years was passed .. umm only 3 years.. and there's less event more? puff we need change something for sure!

do you know that LXDE/LXQT git are directly the sources for packagin rather a tar watch as does traditionally with packages .. since almost always?

@dzz: Nice to see you around! Hope all is well with you.

FYI, we do have blind users on Devuan.  And the speakup community was consulted when the minimal-live iso was designed.  Perhaps something is getting lost in translation.  I do not always understand what you are trying to say like "sothen" in the topic of this thread.

maybe a better response was "what are you triying to said with that .. or that.. etc" well.. try to not learn by the bad way..

trinity desktop cannot be in any debian oficial or devuan oficial repository YET due two reasons:

* uses prefix=/opt due the scheme naming convention namespaces respect kde ones
* there's still many applications with same name as kde4 counterparts
* there's too many defaults settings that are winbutu specific due developers seems used that, like sudo..

currently trinity team are made those changes but since raised kde4 that work are not finished yet! so if both teams join efforts can provide a complete desktop.. and i must point here that TDE are far far away more faster thant LXQT of course..

by example those issue not make sense in alpine deskop due alpine does not have kde4 related packages.. so are easyle in that case.. but devuan provides amarok from kde4 that have same applilcation name in the trinity suite...

golinux wrote:
Perhaps something is getting lost in translation.  I do not always understand what you are trying to say like "sothen" in the topic of this thread.

I'm just guessing here but I think he means "so then Devuan as [will become] different [another] distro option," i.e., so then Devuan will become another distro option for people to consider.

golinux wrote:

If Xfce goes south I suspect we might move to a WM rather than full-blown desktop as the default.

Please consider moving to LXQT as well.
It's a full-featured desktop (or almost), and faster than both XFCE and LXDE.

it's clear that all of you dont use TDE any time! any body that tested TDE and LXQT see the clear  and faster difference between the TDE and the LXQT.. pcman already said on time ago that QT are more easy to develop but of course consumes a lot more rather GTK and now qt5 obviously consumes LOT more thant any TDE application..

later golinux said:

if devuan will use on a wm only how the orca can read the positions?  and does not work..  puff

also refracta installer in live-cd does not work with orca! neither..

but take easy i currently tested the beowulf lasted with @Mijailo_Arsco : https://www.blindworlds.com/usuario/ver/mijailo-arsco to give another oportunity and see what are changed in devuan